Should we get back to this Coburlin issue again?



#26

Hi, all;

I'm completely sorry to bring back this issue again, and I hope that the regular contributors that actually are here for calculators and related subjects do not take it wrong, but we'd been invaded by the Coburlin matters a few weeks ago and Coburlin himself (or whatever it was) decided to express his own, totaly profit driven, thoughts amongst us.

I know that a few guys, that either do not want or do not have the intention to reveal their own names as many serious contributors in here do, may not be aware of these previous headake of ours, but I'd sinserely vote for removing any posts relating Coburlin when Coburlin is the only subject. C'mon, we're all here to discuss calculators subjects, not non-calculators subjects. We all know already what Coburlin does and I for one don't care a damn bit. I'd rather not seeing a thread with 14 entries about Coburlin that add nothing but waste space in this forum.

Thre is a lot more important and interesting things to be discussed here.

To those of you that are only accidental readers, please, I ask you not to consider this as personal or offensive, instead a call for peacefull, relaxing and constructive readings among the ones found here.

To those of you that are regular contributors and have already had the chance to contact me off-line and consider me as a serious contributor as well, please, forgive me again. I know that one of the subjects that is clearly mentioned as one of the discussed subjects here is 'tips on buying'. I see no actual contribution on discussing Coburlin's techniques here.

Thanks and forgive me.

Luiz (Brazil)

Edited: 26 June 2005, 6:33 p.m. after one or more responses were posted


#27

BRAVO


#28

Perhaps we could a seperate forum where we can discuss buying and selling HP calculators..?

Mike T.


#29

Occasionally, I enjoy the soap-opera issues, but I understand others don't.

I'd be in favor of dividing this Forum into a small number of sub-fora:

** Restoration/repair
** Simulation & new calculator efforts
** Programming & performance testing, programming puzzles
** advice on buying/selling
** soap opera, politics, news, etc - vaguely related to HP Calc.

Perhaps a few trusted people would have permission to bump any thread from specific fora to the General forum.


#30

Hi, John;

I'm sorry if I put some rant in my words. I like reading funny things here, I actually tell my students that science proves men is the only animal that expresses hapinnes by laughing, and I like laughing when I see/hear something funny. I also tell my students that serious people are the ones that know when to start and stop laughing. Bad humorous people are not necessarily serious people, right?

I just think that this particular issue is anoying, although necessary sometimes (some medicine are, too). I agree with the fact that mentioning Coburlin's atrocities calls our attention to the dammage he can cause. And as you see, mentioning his name deviates our attention w=to what is, as I see, interesting to the main community.

I apologize for posting about this, I'd rather stay in silence, but I think if all of us who disagree stay in silence, this wonderfull place Dave Hicks offers us to spread our knowledge and common interests related to calculators around will be, in fact, spread appart. Many good voices stay in silence when Coburlin is the issue.

Thanks for your post. I agree that life diserves good moments. And laughing is part of it.

Best regards.

Luiz (Brazil)

Edited: 26 June 2005, 10:17 p.m.

#31

This is a serious issue - there is a predator out there, clever, thoroughly dishonest, and totally disdainful of us calculator nerds. To him, we're just idiots to be preyed upon. By periodically informing the community of his current activities it may alert new guys that not all who come here have the best interests in mind.

#32

For as long as ebay has existed, there have been people who made money by snapping up items at low prices and selling them for much more. These people seem to fall into two distinct camps: People who use one ebay account to do everything, and people who use two. The two-accounters further break down as to how they obtain two accounts - some use relatives and friends giving them not only two account names but completely unrelated real names and mailing addresses.

People in the one-account camp get picked on. People don't like to see people buy an item on ebay and then sell it for much more. (Never mind that many items on ebay were picked up somewhere else for much less.) However, people who do the same thing with two accounts are frequently well-loved by the collecting community. The buyer identity is well-loved because he seems to be a regular guy just like the rest of us fanatics. We'll even overlook warning signs like that he only buys HP calculators and his feedback rating has four digits. Likewise the seller identity is also well-loved because he seems to have a magical source of so many HPs.

Honestly, I don't know why someone who buys a thousand or more HPs and never appears to sell them seems like a "good guy" anyway. If he was really taking HPs off the market at that rate, then prices would really go up.

People in the two-account camp have even used this forum (posting under an alias) to attack their one-account competitors. One of the harshest attacks on a one-accounter came from a person who was then believed to be a "good guy" but later was revealed to be a two-accounter.

I've come close to banning ebay talk on this forum, but I've avoided it because I really don't want to stop people from talking about what interests them, however, let's try this: The next time you want to post something about Coburlin, ask yourself: Is Coburlin doing anything really new? And is there really anything specifically HP calculator-related?

There are many more one-acounters, and you have no way of knowing how many two-accounters there are. You may have just bought something from someone doing exactly the same thing - only he's clever enough to hide it with two accounts.

I'm open to the idea of opening one or more additional forums, but I'm not sure an ebay discussion forum is the one I'd really most like to add at this time.


#33

You're right Dave, there are far more interesting topics than Ebay on this forum.

Likewise TV programs such as "Cops live", everybody agrees that this is crap but there will still be a lot of people watching it... Coburlin is a "crap" topic but a lot of us will read the thread because it concerns almost everybody, as ebay is one of the only old HP distribution channel.

Therefore a forum split dedicated to ebay is for me a fine solution : likewise your auction / not auction filter in the classified ads section, everyone is free to volounteerly browse the topic. You could limit space by e.g. automatically deleting posts after X months, and refrain any HTML...

A second option would be to create an external ebay dedicated forum, but I prefer the former.

#34

Please, no sub-forums. Topics overlap. Information in one sub-forum will often be relevant in another sub-forum. With the current format, it's easy enough to skip the posts we're not interested in.


#35

I tend to agree with Ron - leave it all in one big mess. We can skip whatever is not interesting.

Our Community College "everyone" address was terminated a few months ago, because somebody posted confidential information about a student. Instead of deleting the offender, the whole system was taken down. It was a GREAT way to keep up with whatever was interesting, current affairs, gossip, etc. The IT guys then established some kind of a bulletin board system (with lousy software - they shoulda checked here first!) where anybody could start a new topic, which was invisible unless you went looking for it. So, you wind up with 25 hard-to-find topics, that nobody reads. I haven't checked it in two months, whereas I used to check the original system several times a day. It's just not worth the effort.

Moral (IMHO): don't fragment things, and let individuals decide what they want to read or skip.

#36

I have never found a better organized nor more approachable system ever.

Like Ron says, we can easily skip the stuff we don't want. At the same time, we can see everything that is available. And since the cookies keep track of what we personally have read, we can go quickly through. And the default tree system, the fact we can branch off down---all works great--much better than the locked-in single thread per topic type. Really, I am impressed more than words---I keep running into other forums and they just don't come anywhere close!

I would love to be able to search across archives, or do combined poster and topic refinement (like, "hmmm, what was it that Gene said about the BAII vs the 12c.......") but I think this is a minor enough thing that I am willing to be patient!

Thanks again Dave, for a great "universe."

Best regards,

Bill Platt


Edited: 8 July 2005, 10:29 p.m.

#37

True, there are certainly those who do far worse than Coburlin on eBay.

A nice things about him is that he bids early, so anyone who's willing to spend the money can always outbid him. Well, except in the case of "Buy it now" items, but I suspect that some of us might've bought those items if we'd happened to see them before he did.

As far as I can see, that auction that ended early to sell to the current highest bidder was an unusual case; who knows why the seller made that decision.

Regards,
James

#38

I was gone for the weekend in the mountains in a resort with no TV, phone, and internet access. When I came back I saw the thread about coburlin and also one about nonpareil posted by Eric Smith. For me, clearly, Eric's message regarding posting a Windows version of the nonpareil IS BY FAR THE MORE RELEVANT! I downloaded Eric's software and ran the emulators of various calculators. WOW! That was really interesting! Whet Co-whatever does with his calculators on eBay means nothing here!

Namir


#39

What is more, I guess nonpareil might drive the prices down...
Anyway, now I can try before I buy.
Thanks to Eric


Arnaud


#40

Armand,

YOu are right. With electronic versions that will not need batteries to replace (or contact to corrode), keys to wear off, display to go bad, AND the ability to save/load calc info to PC files ... it's nicer to play with the emulators.

Namir

#41

What if automatically blocking any posting containing the word "Curbloin" or any of its possible combinations?


#42

Too restrictive and unweildy.

We see mto be pretty darn good at self-policing here (with occasional very quiet help from our sponsor). I really like the fact that we seem to be able to resolve things here without lots of rules or overlording. It is such a wonderful breath of fresh air in our freedom-starved existence (seatbelts, bike helmets, boat driver licenses, expansion of eminent domain, ...not that they are all bad...but they certainly take the individual's freedom to choose away.....)


#43

I was just kidding. Anyway, whatever restriction is made, they are easily overcome: people would simply insert blank spaces, symbols or the like.
I myself don't feel bother by hearing people complaing about you know who. Actually they sometimes gets frustrated when this guys tries to make money out of our 'sacred' calculators. I would like to add there still life off e-Bay, I recently purchased an excellent harldy used 35 complete with travel case, leather case, manual and charger for less than one third of that guy is asking for a worse one. And I've just traded a mint 11C for a 12C.

Best regards,

Gerson.


#44

GWB posted,

Quote:
And I've just traded a mint 11C for a 12C.

I would hope that your statement was reversed -- that is, you traded (away) a 12C (in return) for a mint 11C...

As for the main subject, I agree with those who not recommend that the Forum be split into sub-groups. Topics do overlap. Those who ask for sub-Forums certainly don't mind proposing more work for Dave...

-- KS


#45

Oops!

Thanks for pointing out my mistake. I'll get another 12C, but this time I'll wait until I find a good one (Non-China made).

About the forum not having to be split into subgroups, I totally agree with you.

Gerson.


#46

Wait a minute...

You traded a Chinese 12C for a mint 11C?

When you find a non-Chinese 12C, you'll trade the mint 11C straight across - Right? I mean, we're all just as willing to trade down, as to trade up - Right? Because if we're only willing to trade up, that would seem to put us into the same category as what's-his-name. :^0

I'm not criticizing you, Gerson, as I wouldn't hesitate to make the same trade you just made. But for people like me (up-traders) to criticize Coburlin, seems a little like the hole calling the doughnut, "round."

IMHO


#47

Quote:
When you find a non-Chinese 12C, you'll trade the mint 11C straight across - Right? I mean, we're all just as willing to trade down, as to trade up - Right? Because if we're only willing to trade up, that would seem to put us into the same category as what's-his-name. :^0

As a rule I don't trade, neither down nor up. In fact, I did not want to trade that 12C. I just found an 11C announced on a local e-auction as like new and made a bid (the auction ended about USD $100.00). During the auction, the seller said he wanted a 12C, so I offered mine. After the auction, I warned him mine was a poor quality Chinese one, he said there was no problem, because he needed a 12C for his work. When he received the 12C he liked it very much.

When I was a student, like many others, I would sell an older calculator to buy a new one. The only calculator I sold recently (3 month ago), was a never used silver bezel 32Sii, sold for about $80.00 dollars (the same amount I had paid) to someone here who wanted it so much, because I have a Brown Bezel I like it better - but that was before I started collecting them. Anyway, I don't want to have each and every model, most likely my collection will never have more than 12 items. (However I appreciate those collections that include even all different ROM versions of the same model)

What I have so far:

1 HP-11C; 1 HP-15C; 1 HP-32SII; 1 HP-35; 1 HP-42S; 1 HP 48GX and 2 HP82240B IR printers, one new in box (but these don't count);


... and what is missing:

an HP-12C, an HP-28S, an HP-55, an HP-67, and, of course, an HP41CV or CX. (But please don't offer them to me now, as currently I am neither purchasing nor trading.)

Best regards,

Gerson.

#48

I respectfully request that the forum *NOT* be censored of warnings about certain eBay sellers.

Nearly 32 years ago, I was a college freshman who went into debt for many months in order to buy an HP-35, and who really lusted after an HP-65 but could not think of buying on then. This itch finally demanded scratching, so I went to eBay.

I quickly observed a certain eBay seller, with ID starting with "C". Thanks to the forum here (and yes, I searched the archives as well), I determined that my suspicions were valid.

I understand how, to the regulars, repeated postings about someone's bad behavior can be annoying. Nevertheless, there are newcomers/short-time visitors who benefit by such postings.

I now have pretty much everything that I wanted, and so I'll probably be bowing out of both eBay's HP calculator market and this forum. But, I do not want to leave with saying "thank you."

Thank you. You're a great bunch of folks.


#49

"Blurdybloop" said,

Quote:
I now have pretty much everything that I wanted, and so I'll probably be bowing out of both eBay's HP calculator market and this forum. But, I do not want to leave with saying "thank you."

Thank you. You're a great bunch of folks.


Thanks for the collective acknowledgement. You're welcome!

My HP history has similarities -- I lusted after the HP-41 as a high school senior in 1980, but couldn't afford it; saw an appealing HP-34C the following year, and bought a HP-15C in 1983.

I also have most of what I want, mostly from eBay and a local seller -- the fine, "mature" HP calc's introduced between 1979-1993.

Are you sure that your collection is complete? There's a world of excellence beyond the early LED-based models (if, in fact, that's what you focused on).

-- KS

#50

Quote:
I now have pretty much everything that I wanted, and so I'll probably be bowing out of both eBay's HP calculator market and this forum.


I can understand bowing out of eBay's calculator market, but why bow out of this forum? If you do that, you'll miss out on a lot informative and entertaining discussion from a good group of people. You will also miss out on new developments, like Nonpareil, Free42, OpenRPN, etc. So stick around.

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