82163B



#9

I have a 82163B Video Interface that I would like to sell on ebay but I want to make sure that it will work in the USA.
What I mean is - there is a tv output as well as a monitor output. Here in Australia we use pal and in USA is NTSC. Is this just for color or does it apply to Black and White as well. Was there a different version of the 82163 for USA.

Thanks Malcolm


#10

Malcolm,

NTSC and PAL are different with or without color. NTSC is 60Hz. and PAL is 50Hz.

My interface is a 82163A model for the USA.

In the manual is this note.

* One HP-IL Cable.

* One ac adaptor.

* One TV/monitor cable.

* One switch box(inside the U.S.A.) or one cable adaptor (outside the U.S.A.)

note:

This manual specifies the TV channel used by the HP 82163A, which is the version designed for operation in the U.S.A.

Chris


#11

Thanks Chris,

Would I be safe in assuming that the Monitor interface is independant. ie same for 82163A and 82163B.

Also here in Aus most older TV's came with NTSC and PAL inputs, was this the case in the USA as well.


Thanks Malcolm


#12

Would I be safe in assuming that the Monitor interface is independant. ie same for 82163A and 82163B.

The monitor interface is most likely before the RF(TV) output. So they would not be the same on both units. PAL is PAL either composite or RF.

NTSC is 30fps or 60 fields per second. PAL is 25fps or 50 fields per second.

Also here in Aus most older TV's came with NTSC and PAL inputs, was this the case in the USA as well.

No this was not the case with consumer TV's. Atleast I never came across any. The only NTSC/PAL "monitors"(not TVs) that I saw was when I worked in the broadcast/industrial video business. Mainly VERY expensive monitors in studio control rooms and editing suites. Even these were rare to say the least.

I think your "B" model is PAL only and will have very limited use in the USA.

I am not an expert concering HP's different models of this unit though. If anybody can contradict my conclusions on this please do.

I just thought of something when proofing this message Comodore made some NTSC/PAL "monitors". I remember being able to run some PAL programs on my Amiga A1000/A2000 computer. But that was a long long time ago in a far away land...

Chris


#13

Quote:
I think your "B" model is PAL only and will have very limited use in the USA.

I have a couple of computers with PAL output and I can view their output (in black and white) on NTSC monitors that have vertical hold and vertical size controls. The color subcarrier is different, so I can't see the color from my BBC Model B. But both NTSC and PAL use a horizontal frequency of about 15,750 Hz, so the hard part works!


#14

I have a couple of computers with PAL output and I can view their output (in black and white) on NTSC monitors that have vertical hold and vertical size controls. The color subcarrier is different, so I can't see the color from my BBC Model B. But both NTSC and PAL use a horizontal frequency of about 15,750 Hz, so the hard part works!

Thanks Ellis, Black & White would be fine as you/we know the video interfaces don't do color.

Malcom, there is some hope for being able to use your "B" unit in the U.S. They only slight problem is that the manufactures seem to be removing these controls from monitors. For what reasons I can't think of except cost maybe?

Chris


#15

I wouldn't try to use a 82163B on an NTSC monitor.
It is more than the color encoding that differs.

To make a long story short, this is the difference between 82163A and 82163B:

              82163A    82163B
Frequency 61.25 MHz 62.25 MHz
Lines 525 625
Update freq. 60 Hz 50 Hz

(I sure hope that became readable...)


#16

61.25 MHz would be within US TV channel 3 (I believe it is 60-66 MHz) and I know the video carrier is near one end of the channel and the audio carrier is 4.5 MHz above the video, which would be 65.75 if I am correct. So I think that frequency refers to the RF modulator output and not the video output. It is true that the vertical frequency is very different but monitors with vertical hold and size adjustments usually have a lot of range, and since the horizontal frequency is almost identical (about 15.75 kHz), that part is no problem.

But I thought the PAL version of the 82163 didn't include an RF modulator. Also, I understand the RF frequency commonly used in the UK, at least, for connecting things to a TV was in the vicinity of US UHF TV channel 33 (around 584 MHz : [(channel - 14) * 6] + 470 MHz) - I first learned this from a friend who ordered the Sinclair 1000 as a kit from England and then later, found the same to be the case with my BBC Model B. Whatever the exact frequency, a TV with adjustable fine tuning can display the black and white signal as long as the vertical is also adjustable. But 62.25 MHz would still be within US TV channel 3.

US TV channels are all 6 MHz wide and are separated into three bands: 2-6 (VHF low) starting at 54 MHz, 7-13 (VHF high) starting at 174 MHz, and 14-69 (UHF) starting at 470 MHz. There used to be a channel 1 but the frequency was given to amateur radio. Also, there used to be UHF channels 70-83, I think those frequencies are now used for cell phones.


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