PIL-box w/o IL cable = paper weight

[Joe Horn]

Since so many of you recommended getting a PIL-box, I finally broke down and spent the 117 euros to order one (price included shipping to California). But it comes without an IL cable, and I can't find one ANYWHERE.

Having a PIL-box and not being able to use it is causing me severe emotional distress. Please help me save what little is left of my sanity and point me towards a source of IL cables. MThx!

-Joe-

EDIT: This hunt is now over; Bart will be sending me a cable from the UK. Thanks, Bart!

Edited: 20 Nov 2013, 7:43 a.m. after one or more responses were posted

[Jim Horn]

I don't think I have any anymore but can't rule it out. Unfortunately if I do, they are in storage heaven knows where. That's the bad news.

Since such cables are likely needed more than they are available, I'll check into the HP-IL specs and see what existing pins and sockets should work for them. The cable itself (100 ohm pair, as I recall) is no big deal. And we recently got two Makerbot 3D printers at work. So converting the mechanical drawing for the connector in the spec to Makerbot files, adding off-the-shelf pins and wi0r-eps0- // kittens and keyboards!! // wires should make useable substitutes.

Meanwhile, if any Forum folk have any to spare, *please* let Joe know! Many thanks!!!

[Jim Horn]

Bleah! I just looked up the HP-IL Interface Specification which includes a mechanical spec (Chapter 4). It has nice drawings of the male and female connectors but only overall dimensions. There are not enough dimensions to actually define the connectors or any information on the contacts used in them. So trying to duplicate them using the official documents won't be possible. It also has an error in defining the reference line for one of them. Definitely not IEEE level documentation. Too bad there wasn't enough HP Corporate support to push that through. Sigh.

I had a sizable binder of HP-IL information including the above Specification as well as development notes when the whole HP-IL was being conceived in the early 1980s. It may have been given away at the last HHC I was at along with a lot of other items from back then. If not and I find it, it may have more dimensional information though I don't remember seeing anything back then. The alternative would be to measure an actual HP-IL cable's connectors.

There's still an 8216x HP-IL to GPIO module around here somewhere which has the panel connector if all else fails. That would be in my garage. Reverse engineering mating connectors shouldn't be to horrible for an old EE. Time to dust off ancient (circa 1992) AutoCAD skills...

Jim (digging like my dog through boxes around here!)

[Joe Horn]

Thanks, Jim, for hunting for HP-IL cables, but you don't need to. Bart has kindly offered to send me a cable.

-Joe-

[J-F Garnier]

Hi Joe,

I'm happy that you found one HP-IL cable (I usually warn that the HP-IL cable is NOT provided, didn't I?).

The reason the cable is not provided is that I CAN'T provide one for each PIL-Box, I don't have a large stock, just a few spare cables and I didn't find any substitute for the genuine cable.

J-F

[Joe Horn]

Quote:

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I usually warn that the HP-IL cable is NOT provided, didn't I?).

J-F

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Yes, you make that abundantly clear on your website. I was just having an emotional meltdown trying to find the necessary cable. ;-) Thanks for making the PIL-box!

-Joe-

[Mike (Stgt)]

You still use real hardware?? You could use all virtual.

Ciao.....Mike

[Geoff Quickfall]

No tactile in virtual :-)

Glad you found one Joe!

[Joe Horn]

Quote:

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You still use real hardware?? You could use all virtual.

Ciao.....Mike

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Virtual tools don't read real LIF floppies. Now I can read real LIF floppies (boxes & boxes & boxes of 'em) on a real hardware 9114B using the PIL-box and a Windows 7 laptop. Life is good!

Re-learning the HP-71 won't be as easy. ;-)

-Joe-

[Marcus von Cube, Germany]

Quote:

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Re-learning the HP-71 won't be as easy. ;-)

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In case you don't know already: BASIC Comaprison Sheet. It's my attempt to compare the various BASIC dialects of pocket computers and includes the HP 71B.

[Mark Hardman]

Does this imply that you could be adding to the contents of
http://holyjoe.org/hp/goodies.htm?

[Joe Horn]

Quote:

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Does this imply that you could be adding to the contents of
http://holyjoe.org/hp/goodies.htm?

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Possibly, but the HP-71 Goodies page will definitely be expanding: http://holyjoe.org/HP71/

[Geoff Quickfall]

I know a great book on learning the HP 71b!

[Christoph Giesselink]

Quote:

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Virtual tools don't read real LIF floppies. Now I can read real LIF floppies (boxes & boxes & boxes of 'em) on a real hardware 9114B using the PIL-box and a Windows 7 laptop.

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You're absoluty correct. But when you're one of the late borns like me, you haven't tons of LIF discs in the drawer. So ftp://ftp.hpmuseum.org/lif/ is a treasure trove for this old software. And TNX for JFG's ILPer which give us access to these software and it doesn't matter if you want to load the software to real or emulated/similated hardware.

But when you confirm only on the old storage methods, you don't have to wonder why so may software and sources get lost over the years. Try to get source files or even the ROM images of the Pioneer family calculators made end of the eighties for example. Most of them are saved on media which got lost or are not readable any more...

I know from the early 49G time that you're not a fan of emulated calculators Joe, but many of the HP calculator emulators now have an integrated debugger which allows us a look to software internals and secrets we haven't dreamed 20 or 30 years ago.

So reading "HPX Exchange", "HP Journal", "PPC" or "Prisma" (German Computer Club), ... magazines from end of 80'ies most of these discussed topics can now be answered easily by looking into the decompiled sources or by execute them in a controlled environment by single step execution.

[Paul Berger (Canada)]

I use a mix of real and virtual. A PC hosting virtual devices is nice for a keyboard and display and fast storage, but is not very portable. I also need real hardware to talk to HPIL and HPIB instruments. About the only real devices I don't use any more are the cartridge tape drives and my 2225B.

Edited: 22 Nov 2013, 10:54 p.m.

[Les Wright]

Glad you found one. When I got my HP-IL module some time back the seller threw in a couple of extra cables. I had no idea how much I would appreciate that until I got the PIL-Box some time later. Lovely device. I briefly had a 9114B drive until I killed it (don't ask), so it is really nice to have easy-to-use mass storage.

Les