CAS vs non-CAS in programming the HP Prime



#41

It seems that I am having trouble with this separation of CAS and non-CAS modes with respect to programming. For example, if I use:

seq(x^k,k,8,4,-1)

in CAS mode, I get

[ x^8 x^7 x^6 x^5 x^4 ]

as expected. But if I type this into a program:

EXPORT EXAMPLE()
BEGIN
seq(2^k,k,8,4,-1);
END;

I get a syntax error with the cursor on the k. If I add LOCAL k; then I get the wrong sequence of [1, 1, 1, 1] -- though I could see what went wrong in this case. Even adding in "CAS." at the start of a command does not fix the issues. Just about any sort of symbolic manipulation within a program seems difficult to do. What am I missing? It seems that pretty much anything I do symbolically on the CAS screen does not work very well in a program. While

CAS.expr("seq(2^k,k,8,4,-1)");

seems to work, I get EXPR([256 128 64 32 16]) which is not the same as [256 128 64 32 16] (without the EXPR()). Then there is

CAS.expr("seq(x^k,k,8,4,-1)");

which, when embedded in a program, does not work... and on my emulator, it crashes so badly that the program closes itself out.

Edit: is the program editor's parser different from the home screen parser and/or the CAS parser? my trial and error sessions seem to suggest yes.

Second Edit: I did not try the above on the actual calculator.


Edited: 1 Oct 2013, 10:58 p.m. after one or more responses were posted


#42

Hopefully, this will be fixed soon.

I like the Prime - - it is very fast, runs circles around my 50G, but the user should expect that all (or almost all) commands and functions are available for programming. Just like on previous HP calculators!


#43

It's a nice calculator -- but I would only recommend it to students, and in particular the students who don't really care too much about using anything other than what's already pre-programmed and built-in.

I am sure that my views will change later on once we get a few more updates. I think Tim, Cyrille, and the many other folks who contributed did a great job in getting us a new calculator -- we just have to be patient as the OS matures.

The beta testers, on the other hand, have been measured and been found wanting :-)


#44

Agree.

(Luckily, I'm not a beta tester, or I'd be heading behind the wood shed . . .)

#45

[Prolepsis: Forgive me for being overly touchy today. I just had a molar removed. More aggravation is the last thing I need.]

Your swipe at Prime's beta testers is not only insulting to many people who did much great work, but is also based on ignorance. You don't know how many bugs were found by the beta testers and were removed already, and how many are currently queued up for removal. You don't know the system by which the bugs were rated and prioritized. You don't know the thousands of man hours that have been spent -- and are still being spent -- improving Prime. You don't know how many of your favorite features were originally suggested by beta testers. You can't know these things, because beta testers sign a CDA not to divulge them, for obvious reasons.

Come to think of it, do you know of ANY product of this complexity that was 100% bug free at product release? Of course not! Blame Murphy, not the beta testers!

Yes, I saw the smiley at the end of your posting. It didn't make me feel better. Guess you could say it was measured and found wanting.

-Joe- (One of Prime's beta testers, and damn proud of it)

--> Help / Tree / About / Thanks

Edit: Sorry for over-reacting. I've cooled down now.


Edited: 1 Oct 2013, 6:05 p.m.


#46

I apologize. You are and have been very helpful in all your postings.

But look at it this way also:

I spent $150 for the calculator, was very excited about it, and then find out about crashes with EDITMAT and EDITLIST with user-specified variable names, complex numbers can't be input into a matrix on the command line, plus CAS commands/functions can't be programmed reliably. That does put a damper on things, from my point of view.

#47

Quote:
[Prolepsis: Forgive me for being overly touchy today. I just had a molar removed. More aggravation is the last thing I need.]

Your swipe at Prime's beta testers is not only insulting to many people who did much great work, but is also based on ignorance. You don't know how many bugs were found by the beta testers and were removed already, and how many are currently queued up for removal. You don't know the system by which the bugs were rated and prioritized. You don't know the thousands of man hours that have been spent -- and are still being spent -- improving Prime. You don't know how many of your favorite features were originally suggested by beta testers. You can't know these things, because beta testers sign a CDA not to divulge them, for obvious reasons.

Come to think of it, do you know of ANY product of this complexity that was 100% bug free at product release? Of course not! Blame Murphy, not the beta testers!

Yes, I saw the smiley at the end of your posting. It didn't make me feel better. Guess you could say it was measured and found wanting.

-Joe- (One of Prime's beta testers, and damn proud of it)

--> Help / Tree / About / Thanks

Edit: Sorry for over-reacting. I've cooled down now.


I don't think any apology is needed -- I would rather have beta testers who are as passionate about the calculator as you than someone who is just testing because it's their job. I am, however, familiar with bug prioritization. I have beta tested a number of MMORPGs (the worst are the ones that span over different platforms). I have also beta tested commercial software. Even if we are explicitly told to focus on XYZ, beta testers should always try to break the entire system. And they often do. You see it all the time in the bug reports -- at least on the projects I have been on. And I do recognize that projects as complex as this require lots of man hours to complete. And I also knew before you even posted that there are features that have yet to be implemented (though very likely asked for). We need only look at the TI nSpire and how that evolved to see a close-to-home example. In fact, it would not surprise me that from here on out products will be shipped with new features to be added in the future. Games have downloadable content. Programs get updated constantly. As do firmware. Features left at don't bother me so much as actual bugs, though.

To the typical user, the current state of the Prime is very likely "just fine." They likely will never encounter any of the bugs that have recently surfaced. Most students leave high school and even college having used their graphing calculator mostly for graphing and basic arithmetic (sadly) anyway. So to them, it's as if the Prime were already perfect.

At the end of the day though, the final product is going to be judged based on results. Let's be realistic. It doesn't matter if a billion man hours were put into the project -- any project. Once it goes public, the public have the right to pass judgement -- we do that all the time through reviews, etc. It doesn't matter if everything runs smoothly except for one glitch. If that glitch is annoying enough, people complain. If you are really unlucky (like with Final Fantasy IV), you end up with a product that ruins the entire brand name.

People complain because they, too, are passionate about the product -- if for no other reason than that they paid money out of their own pocket to buy the product. I paid $130 for mine, after all. (Even more if you consider my other 50+ HP calculators.) And just as much as you would feel so passionately about it, there are those who are on the other side (the users) who feel just as passionately about the latest HP calculator.

My complaint (and hence jab at the testers) is that some of the defining features of the HP Prime are precisely where we see bugs -- for me, the defining features were an easier programming language, fast plotting, apps, and supposedly a better CAS than what we have seen so far. In the same way that you feel frustrated after having spent all the time and effort into debugging only to have someone outside of process take a low jab, I too felt frustrated after having exhausted so many different attempts to make a simple program that would do basic symbolic manipulation -- only to have it reset my calculator. I have sent Tim videos in which I get seemingly random resets. I even had my app key turn into a reset key -- so that I was stuck in the Function app forever until I formatted my calculator and anytime I tried to switch to a different app, I'd get HP's nice little logo and some nice animation suggesting x^2+y^2 is equal to 1.

Now, maybe your hands were tied due to the prioritization of the bugs list... I don't know. And I don't think it even matters. If a bug causes possibly instability, it really should have been found and removed regardless of any priority list.

But if I know you and Tim and all the other developers (despite never having met any of you), you'll keep on working hard to improve an already great calculator regardless of the noise you hear. I know I'll keep using my Prime (even plan to buy several more) and try to contribute what I can to help improve it. Surely you will too, no?

#48

It more isn't an issue of "the bugs weren't found", but rather one of prioritization, looking at what will cause the largest impact for the largest number of people, and making touch decisions on where to focus finite resources.

TW


#49

Is it actually helpful and valuable to you if users post here? Maybe we're not telling you anything new - - in that case, please say so.


#50

It is very helpful and desirable. It allows collection of issues and concerns that get passed on an help shape future efforts in many ways.

TW


Edited: 1 Oct 2013, 7:28 p.m. after one or more responses were posted


#51

OK sounds good.

And no more remarks about beta testers, promise!


#52

The only thing that really ever bothers me personally about getting user feedback is when people go on amazon or similar and do the "1 star because feature X isn't what I want". Granted, that may be a valid personal opinion, but I've always been the opinion that it seems a bit hyperbolic and isn't helpful for anyone really. Same thing for a "5-star! Would definitely upvote again!" type review. :-)

Honest criticism and opinions are always desired. While true that we knew there will be a collection of people that view the lack of 50g level programming capability from day 1 as a complete non-starter and will definitely yell that "Prime is completely useless" and so on, that also seems a bit extreme from my personal perspective (yet understandable).

Han's very nice 3d grapher program is a great example of the type of programming and capabilities we really shot to allow for the first release. To do that type of thing on any other machine with close to the same speed, you have to get down to assembly or other low level code. Has anyone figured out how to do the entire matrix calculation using a single command yet? :-)

TW

Edited: 1 Oct 2013, 7:29 p.m.


#53

Quote:
Has anyone figured out how to do the entire matrix calculation using a single command yet? :-)

TW


If you are referring to what I think you're referring, I had thought about creating a single matrix of the form

[ [x1, x2, x3, x4, ..., xn ]
[y1, y2, y3, y4, ..., yn ]
[z1, z2, z3, z4, ..., zn ]]

and multiplying it by the final rotation product (Rot). But I dismissed this thinking that it would be more computationally intensive than running it through a loop. Your post makes me want to try it out :-)

#54

Having been a beta tester on other systems, not this one, I must concur with Joe's posting.

Molar removed or not, if I were a BETA tester I would proudly stand in front of the wood shed and be eminently proud of the product.

Now we shall see the OS improve over time as new bugs are found just as the B777, B787, Windows and Apples have all improved due to user and Beta tester input. I make it a rule never to fly a newly designed aircraft fresh out of the factory. I let the beta testers have all the glory on it.

Not to mention the incredible job the creators,; Cyrille, Tim and etc have done within budget constraints imposed by the corp.

So make a list of the bugs, don't be judgmental as it gets us absolutely no where!

Geoff


#55

>Having been a beta tester on other systems

Coming from an airline pilot, this statement somehow does not make me feel great... ;-P


TW


#56

Ha!

I don't beta test aircraft, they are called test pilots. However, as with all complex systems, bugs come thru and procedures are created to adapt to the bugs until the next OS is created.

For example, one can load the entire flight plan on to the on board computer which include procedures for departure, climb, cruise, descent and arrival. It was noted on a recent update to the OS that if you loaded the computer with the arrival procedure at the departure gate that both computers would fail. That meant reverting to another set of procedures which involve more work but not impacting safety. The fix was, load the arrival during cruise, this will prevent the failure.

When the next OS came out the entire problem was fixed, however, my airline still loads the arrival procedure while in cruise just in case that bug sneaks back in.

My point was, it doesn't matter how mature an OS is, or how good the designers are, or how rigorous the beta testers are, things sneak through do to the complexity.

Besides, it takes an IQ of 180 to fly a B777. That's why there are two of us!

d:-D

Edited: 1 Oct 2013, 8:07 p.m.

#57

Quote:
Having been a beta tester on other systems, not this one, I must concur with Joe's posting.

Molar removed or not, if I were a BETA tester I would proudly stand in front of the wood shed and be eminently proud of the product.

Now we shall see the OS improve over time as new bugs are found just as the B777, B787, Windows and Apples have all improved due to user and Beta tester input. I make it a rule never to fly a newly designed aircraft fresh out of the factory. I let the beta testers have all the glory on it.

Not to mention the incredible job the creators,; Cyrille, Tim and etc have done within budget constraints imposed by the corp.

So make a list of the bugs, don't be judgmental as it gets us absolutely no where!

Geoff


Thank you Geoff!

#58

Quote:
It's a nice calculator -- but I would only recommend it to students, and in particular the students who don't really care too much about using anything other than what's already pre-programmed and built-in.

I am sure that my views will change later on once we get a few more updates. I think Tim, Cyrille, and the many other folks who contributed did a great job in getting us a new calculator -- we just have to be patient as the OS matures.

The beta testers, on the other hand, have been measured and been found wanting :-)


Han,

It is obvious that you have never been a beta tester before or you wouldn't have made the snide comment of yours, which seriously offends me. It is also very offensive to other the beta testers. I think Joe Horn clearly explained this in his response.

If you have not noticed, I AM NOT SMILING.


Edited: 1 Oct 2013, 9:08 p.m.


#59

Quote:
Han,

It is obvious that you have never been a beta tester before or you wouldn't have made the snide comment of yours, which seriously offends me. It is also very offensive to other the beta testers. I think Joe Horn clearly explained this in his response.

If have not noticed, I AM NOT SMILING.


I don't think I'll ever convince you that I have ever beta tested even if I showed you contracts because you have already decided for yourself that I never was one based on a single comment. I understand that you found it offensive (now, anyway, though at the time of writing I can assure it was not meant to offend). I will say, however, that I make no apologies for that comment.

Do I realize that bugs will always exist in complex systems? Yes. If the bugs were the type that only comes up because someone found some esoteric way to to break the unit, then my comment was completely uncalled for. You may have taken offense, but perhaps a more important question is: Should I as a buyer take offense in that I spent $130 on a product that resets itself because I wrote a 3-line program?

Or perhaps every single beta tester noticed that same behavior (see Helge's post for examples of short programs that cause warmstarts) and it got pushed down the priority list. Are we now suggesting that the programmers did not listen to their own beta testers when they found a warmstarting condition? (I would like to believe that the latter does not actually happen in practice.)

You're taking that comment as if we don't have any appreciation for any of the folks who had any hand in making this project come together. You could not be more wrong. If that were the case, I would have just returned my calculator for a refund; why bother posting bug reports about a calculator I presumably care so little about? I don't suppose I, too, should get offended, pack my bags, take my ball, and go home... ?

That comment was made in jest in the sense of "hehe, I can't believe they let this one get past them." The reference is to the movie "A Knight's Tale":

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0183790/quotes

If you cannot allow this as a possible interpretation for my comment with the smiley at the end, then that is an issue you will have to deal with.


#60

I do appreciate all of your postings here. You brought up excellent points, which should help all of us in the long run, as the Prime (hopefully) gets to become more mature.

Consider yourself as an (unpaid) beta tester!

And yes, I totally agree, unstable conditions, such as crashes resulting from a simple 4-line program should have been taken care of.

Perhaps that Prime has been released a tad too early?

#61

Quote:

I don't think I'll ever convince you that I have ever beta tested even if I showed you contracts because you have already decided for yourself that I never was one based on a single comment. I understand that you found it offensive (now, anyway, though at the time of writing I can assure it was not meant to offend). I will say, however, that I make no apologies for that comment.

Do I realize that bugs will always exist in complex systems? Yes. If the bugs were the type that only comes up because someone found some esoteric way to to break the unit, then my comment was completely uncalled for. You may have taken offense, but perhaps a more important question is: Should I as a buyer take offense in that I spent $130 on a product that resets itself because I wrote a 3-line program?

Or perhaps every single beta tester noticed that same behavior (see Helge's post for examples of short programs that cause warmstarts) and it got pushed down the priority list. Are we now suggesting that the programmers did not listen to their own beta testers when they found a warmstarting condition? (I would like to believe that the latter does not actually happen in practice.)

You're taking that comment as if we don't have any appreciation for any of the folks who had any hand in making this project come together. You could not be more wrong. If that were the case, I would have just returned my calculator for a refund; why bother posting bug reports about a calculator I presumably care so little about? I don't suppose I, too, should get offended, pack my bags, take my ball, and go home... ?

That comment was made in jest in the sense of "hehe, I can't believe they let this one get past them." The reference is to the movie "A Knight's Tale":

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0183790/quotes

If you cannot allow this as a possible interpretation for my comment with the smiley at the end, then that is an issue you will have to deal with.


I stand corrected by assuming you were never a beta tester.

Regarding your comment, you understand but you won't apologize. OK I won't apologize for "misinterpreting" your comment.

Edited: 1 Oct 2013, 10:17 p.m.


#62

Quote:
I stand corrected by assuming you were never a beta tester.

Regarding your comment, you understand but you won't apologize. OK I won't apologize for "misinterpreting" your comment.



I understand that as beta testers sometimes we are more than just that -- we are emotionally invested in the project. For the record, I consider myself quite emotionally invested (as a collector) and also financially invested. It would not surprise me the least if the majority of the beta testers were also collectors in addition to having greatly contributed to the history of HP calculators. (In fact, I expected nothing less than the best contributors from that past to be a part of that beta testing team.) Now, with an objective mind, just look at some of the simple cases of warmstarts that have been posted within the past week. I count 3 so far. They are fairly simple to replicate. No one expects an apology for each bug reported (unless there was some irreparable harm done -- not applicable here). Given this much, and note especially the bold text above, why is it that I must be the one to remove myself emotionally from this discussion to apologize for a joke about how the beta testers let these few get by them?

That said, I don't think you should feel obligated to apologize either.


#63

If you want to use CAS commands in a program, the best is to write a CAS program, i.e. a program that is parsed and run from the CAS (this is different from writing a HOME program with a CAS command inside). Currently the UI is not very comfortable, you must enter a small program from the CAS commandline (e.g. example():=BEGIN LOCAL c; c:=seq(x^k,k,8,4,-1); RETURN c; END;), then you can edit it with the program editor and run it from the CAS commandline. CAS programming should allow everything you can do in Xcas programs. For example here you can add k to the LOCAL declaration, then purge(k); before c:=seq(...) so that k behaves like a symbolic variable (might be required for some CAS commands) and does not affect the global variable k. Or you can use functions as arguments to CAS programs.
Example:
mynewton(f,guess,eps,maxiter):=
BEGIN
LOCAL a,j,g;
g:=id-f/f';
a:=guess;
FOR j FROM 1 TO maxiter DO
a:=g(a);
IF abs(f(a))<eps THEN RETURN a; END;
END;
END
Then mynewton(x->x^2-2,1.0,1e-6,10) will return an approx value of sqrt(2), while mynewton(x->x^2-2,1,1e-6,10) will return a fraction that is an approx value of sqrt(2).

On the subject of the tone of the messages, I believe that posters should have a look at Atlas FAQ.
This applies to Xcas of course, but I think it also applies to the Prime, because developers or beta-testers are doing extra support job here. This is not only a mark of respect for the work of others (it is my opinion that paying for something is not an excuse for everything), it is also your best interest if you want to get your wishlist in a good position. I for example won't rush to implement a wish that someone expressed in a arrogant way.


#64

I was going to post a long text about conveying humor; the use of tact and the importance of facial expressions in conversation.

A forum environment is sadly lacking in the necessary tools to prevent what has happened above.

Parisse's post, second paragraph has saved me the trouble.

All the information about bugs, crashes and etc. are extremely important and I hope all users and testers glean the correct info and can filter out any implied/inferred negativity.

Cheers, Geoff

#65

Hello

required a high priority to resolve this BUG, otherwise I can not programming =(



There are some minor flaws with the treatment of polynomials, and as special request in the history display a polynomial coefficients as p [1,2,3], to differentiate it from an array (vector or matrix)

http://jaimeza.org/Mathematic/HewlettPackard/HP_Prime_xCAS/HP_Prime_polynomials.pdf


#66

When creating a function such as

EXPORT EXAMPLE (var1, var2, var3)
BEGIN

...

END;

the input screen that you see is what is displayed when run from the program catalogue. If you use the command line, then you can use any input type you want. However, when initialized by the program catalogue "Run" menu command, all variables are initialized to real values. I do not know if this was the intended behavior, but it has been what I have noticed when creating functions (programs that take input as arguments).

#67

perdon in spanish

Desde el editor de programas, un programa randPoly2 que realice NO TRABAJA

CÓDIGO ORIGINAL

EXPORT randPoly2( pdim, il, sl, var, test )

// test: true = symb, false = coeff

Begin

local rp;

rp:= randPoly( pdim, il, sl );

If test == true THEN

return( poly2symb( CAS.expr( "poly1"+rp )), var );

Else

return( CAS.expr( "poly1"+rp));

End;

End;

Ahora desde la ENTRY-LINE, reescribiendo a MAYUSCULAS algunos comandos :(, tambien hay que ELIMINAR todos los comentarios :( de lo contrario genera un ERROR, y pienso que es por causa de usar comentarios abiertos // que hacen que todo lo que este a la derecha no sea interpretado

IF test == true THEN // ... RETURN( poly2symb

[ Request for HP-TEAM ] dar soporte a bloque de comentarios para poder ingresar comentarios en los programas del CAS MODE /* .... * /, de lo contrario un algoritmo sin comentarios es difícil de dar mantenimiento, ademas es una forma de auto-documentarse, si se da soporte a /* */ no se genera problema

IF test == true THEN /* ... * / RETURN( poly2sym


Hay que ELIMINAR también el prefijo EXPORT, esto implica que en el USER CATALOG no se visualiza el nombre de la función o programa :( , espero que den soporte a esto en futuras actualizaciones

CÓDIGO REESCRITO COMO FUNCION

randPoly2( pdim, il, sl, var, test ):= 

BEGIN

LOCAL rp;

rp:= randPoly( pdim, il, sl );

IF test == true THEN

RETURN( poly2symb( expr( "poly1"+rp )), var );

ELSE

RETURN( expr( "poly1"+rp));

END;

END;

Se visualiza asi: ( se perdió el formato y el nombre del programa ) :(

(pdim,il,sl,var,test)->

BEGIN

LOCAL rp;

rp:=randPoly(pdim,il,sl);

IF test = true THEN RETURN(poly2symb(expr("poly1"+rp)),var);

ELSE RETURN(expr("poly1"+rp));; END ;

END;

la diferencia mas notoria es que en la sentencia de ELSE antes de END aparece doble ;; esta sobrando un [;]


randPoly2( 2, 1, 1, x, false ); => poly1[ 1,1,1 ] // 100% OK

pero en

randPoly2( 2, 1, 1, x, true ); => x^2+x+1


Edited: 2 Oct 2013, 11:36 p.m.

#68

Quote:
If you want to use CAS commands in a program, the best is to write a CAS program, i.e. a program that is parsed and run from the CAS (this is different from writing a HOME program with a CAS command inside). Currently the UI is not very comfortable, you must enter a small program from the CAS commandline (e.g. example():=BEGIN LOCAL c; c:=seq(x^k,k,8,4,-1); RETURN c; END;), then you can edit it with the program editor and run it from the CAS commandline. CAS programming should allow everything you can do in Xcas programs. For example here you can add k to the LOCAL declaration, then purge(k); before c:=seq(...) so that k behaves like a symbolic variable (might be required for some CAS commands) and does not affect the global variable k. Or you can use functions as arguments to CAS programs.
Example:
mynewton(f,guess,eps,maxiter):=
BEGIN
LOCAL a,j,g;
g:=id-f/f';
a:=guess;
FOR j FROM 1 TO maxiter DO
a:=g(a);
IF abs(f(a))<eps THEN RETURN a; END;
END;
END
Then mynewton(x->x^2-2,1.0,1e-6,10) will return an approx value of sqrt(2), while mynewton(x->x^2-2,1,1e-6,10) will return a fraction that is an approx value of sqrt(2).

On the subject of the tone of the messages, I believe that posters should have a look at Atlas FAQ.
This applies to Xcas of course, but I think it also applies to the Prime, because developers or beta-testers are doing extra support job here. This is not only a mark of respect for the work of others (it is my opinion that paying for something is not an excuse for everything), it is also your best interest if you want to get your wishlist in a good position. I for example won't rush to implement a wish that someone expressed in a arrogant way.


This is very useful information. It's a rather tedious workaround, though, to creating a CAS program since we essentially have to write our program from the command line. As for the documentation, what is currently available is well organized. It never occurred to me to create an entire program in the command line first, though, since there was already a program editor. Perhaps in the next update when a user creates a new program, they can have a menu option to create a Home-based or CAS-based program. I did not see much in the user manual regarding programming in Home vs CAS mode.


#69

Quote:
This is very useful information. It's a rather tedious workaround, though, to creating a CAS program since we essentially have to write our program from the command line.

You can use the following workaround : enter the programming editor like for a HOME program, remove the EXPORT header, enter your CAS program, press shift-Copy, then tap (Select) all, tap Copy, press CAS, ignore the error message, then Shift-Paste. You must do that only when you create a new program, once a CAS program is parsed, you can edit it like a HOME program.


#70

Quote:

You can use the following workaround : enter the programming editor like for a HOME program, remove the EXPORT header, enter your CAS program, press shift-Copy, then tap (Select) all, tap Copy, press CAS, ignore the error message, then Shift-Paste. You must do that only when you create a new program, once a CAS program is parsed, you can edit it like a HOME program.


Thank you for the tip. I noticed that if one uses the "Cut" menu command, then the block that was cut remains as the top-most item in the Paste menu ([Shift][Menu]). :-)


#71

Quote:
Thank you for the tip. I noticed that if one uses the "Cut" menu command, then the block that was cut remains as the top-most item in the Paste menu ([Shift][Menu]). :-)

Yup, the paste box is a combination of the copy buffer, and the CMD popup from the 50g.

TW

#72

Han,

I think one thing we can both agree is that we are both passionate about what we do. I apologize to you that I let my emotions get the best of me last night.

Eddie


#73

Well said; we're ALL here because we're passionate about our shared interests. It wouldn't be fun without that passion. I just have to remember to KEEP it fun, and avoid letting it get my Irish up. ;-)

-Joe-


#74

I've just received my shiny new Prime from the states (to the UK)... still just playing blind with it because I forgot to bring the cd disc home with me.

Is that a typo on page 2/2 of CAS settings ?

and a side question (If I can without starting a new thread): I only got one USB cable with it (USB A to micro?), I thought it came with a couple.?


#75

> Is that a typo on page 2/2 of CAS settings ?

Maybe... but I don't see one. Do you?

> I only got one USB cable with it (USB A to micro?), I thought it came with a couple.?

No, it only comes with the cable you got. A tantalizing insert is included in the package saying something like "Ignore all references to communication between two HP Prime calculators." It reminds me of this moment in the movie "Inception":

Arthur: "Okay, here's me planting an idea in your head. I say to you, don't think about elephants. What are you thinking about?"

Saito: "Elephants."


#76

Elephants ....mmmmmmmmmm

Now where was I

Well if it's not a typo' it's a word I've not come across before

Rescursive Evaluation

(1st setting on page 2/2 of CAS settings


#77

Quote:
Well if it's not a typo' it's a word I've not come across before

Rescursive Evaluation

(1st setting on page 2/2 of CAS settings


Holy smokes! I've looked at that a zillion times and never saw the extra "s"! Good catch. Thanks!

#78

res-cur-sive; adjective,. From the Latin reservation and circular. Occurs at the reservations desk at airports. Usually when asking for an upgrade, ticket, or some other amenity. Followed by a circular non rational explanation from the gate agent which is repeated many times, hence rescursive.

Usage: that gate agent was rescursive!

:-)

Edited: 3 Oct 2013, 1:05 p.m.


#79

lol

Just thinking - is there a central area for bugs for this thing ?, wouldn't it be easier if they were all reported in one thread ?
Will HP listen to them or are they on their own discovery channel? (:-))


#80

Absolutely, HP is listening, that is why you see the BETA testers and users reporting here and at other related sites. Tim's responses pop up at many PRIME discussion groups.

I personally don't know many discussions forums where designers personally appear, ask for and incorporate changes due to input from the users.

Back to this forum, as with the 15LE, WS34 and now the prime, the design of this board allows important stuff to drift away. It becomes buried in archive and for the lazy, is to much bother to dig up.

It would be wonderful to see a site with the following structure:

WWW.HPPROJECTS.ORG

>WS34
>PROGRAMS
>HARDWARE
>BUGS
>PRIME
>PROGRAMS
>HARDWARE
>BUGS
>15LE
>PROGRAMS
>HARDWARE
>BUGS
>HP41CL
>PROGRAMS
>HARDWARE
>BUGS
>50G
>PROGRAMS
>HARDWARE
>BUGS

...

Problem is, this is a long standing heritage site and getting people out of here to another site is onerous at best. We tried that with the HP41Cl wiki. Every one comes here!

If some one wants to send me a server I will try :-)

Until then, check out this posting:

Wikis

Edited: 3 Oct 2013, 2:07 p.m.


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