new HP15c released in Japan

[NateB]

Here, and on the second page, here

[Lyuka]

HP 15C limited edition (NW250AA)

[Gerson W. Barbosa]

Hello Lyuka,

Do you have information about price? I haven't found any. Thanks!

Gerson.

[Lyuka]

Hi, Gerson

No other information is available so far.
I'm looking forward to see the real New 15C.

Lyuka

[Walter B]

I'd be most interested in the back side ;-)

Walter

[Gerson W. Barbosa]

Because of the larger battery compartment cover? Hopefully the essential information will be there. Let's hope the number on the display has been keyed in or it is just the result of a keystroke sequence like [g] [pi] [g] [HYP^-1] [SIN] [f] [HYP] [SIN] ...

Gerson.

[marais]

The display seems to have less contrast than the original. But I'll buy 3 anyway.

[Gerson W. Barbosa]

If it is as good as that of the new 12C, then it's ok. I hope to buy two of them. Looks like HP will have to make another batch :-)

[Jake Schwartz]

Has anybody noticed the display? When I press PI on my 15C, I get "3.141592654", rather than the last digit being "3". Perhaps the non-math person setting up that display keyed it in manually and didn't know where PI was located on the keyboard. This has me really worried about the smarts of the people in charge.

Jake

[Michael de Estrada]

Try what Gerson said.

[Gerson W. Barbosa]

Perhaps he/she knows pi by heart to more digits than the display can hold and just did not want to round it up. The Japanese are great memorizers, as we know. I never went beyond the rounded 12 digits, but recently I have gone a little further: 3.1415926535897932 :-)

Gerson.

[Michael de Estrada]

I've got better things to do than memorize pi to 16 digits. Like remember the names of all my relatives. :P

[Gerson W. Barbosa]

Actually, I didn't try to. It's just that they appeared constantly in a problem I was working on that I couldn't help but memorizing them, till when I don't know. There was a time I knew about 30 phone numbers by heart, now I am glad I still know my own ones :-)

[Ángel Martin]

Maybe they changed the rounding algorithms, hey for what we know it may even have a non-lifting stack pi :-)

Sure it looks suspicious, oversight or intentional??

[Gene Wright]

Oh, I would assume someone who does not know the value of PI keyed it in from a list and did not properly round to 3.141592654.

Doh!

[Ángel Martin]

Quote:

---

...value of PI keyed it in from a list and did not properly round to 3.141592654

---

Hmmm, this is most intriguing - or somebody is tripping us all up knowing how predictable we are.

But it could be related to the extended precision that (supposedly) the new machine has got - who knows, maybe they used a truncation to the classic 10-digit mantissa instead of a ROUNDING?

Gosh I'd hope not...

[Alejandro Paz (Germany)]

Any sightings on these shores yet ? I also want... 2 :)

[Ángel Martin]

Now this is a strange market strategy or just a rabid marketing ploy: why Japan first, and why all the surrounding silence in the rest of the world?? It makes no sense in these days of global economy, unless this is a gigantic beta-site plan.

And how limited is limited??

[Walter B]

Very clever - they decided to launch it in the country of the new world champion ;-)

[hpnut]

Quote:

---

Now this is a strange market strategy or just a rabid marketing ploy: why Japan first, and why all the surrounding silence in the rest of the world?? It makes no sense in these days of global economy, unless this is a gigantic beta-site plan.

And how limited is limited??

---

if HP had taken note of the Bring Back the HP 15C campaign, they would have released it in Australia, France, Germany, Hong Kong or USA first to gauge the response.

http://hp15c.org/Countries.php

I was also wondering if such a newly re-introduced 15C would depress the auction prices in TAS ;-)

[Lyuka]

The color pdf manual of the hp-15C got available online now!

(though its contents are of 1987)

You will find the small hp-15C image in the page below, with 'Limited edition' letters on it!

'HP 15c Adv. Prog. Scientific Calculator '

Lyuka

[hpnut]

Hi Lyuka,

I still can't find the HP 15C in the shopping cart!

http://www.shopping.hp.com/can/calculator/HP/1/storefronts;HHOJSID=fZkJTkdpXq1HJsqnlKz42LX1TlxnfnGbQhGbQhtM2PkfpQzL1KV1!1516178979?jumpid=in_R329_prodexp/hhoslp/psg/lateralnav_calculators

so HP is just into releasing manuals of classics, eh? ;-)

hpnut in Malaysia

[hpnut]

Lyuka,

thanks for the heads up. the color pdf manual is nice, as are the interesting art illustrations in it.

[Katie Wasserman]

You do realize that the color manual is the scan from Dave's DVD set available here. The watermark "copyright MoHPC" is still on some of the pages.

[robert rozee]

Quote:

---

The color pdf manual of the hp-15C got available online now!

(though its contents are of 1987)

[...]

Lyuka

---

look at the bottom of the third page of the pdf, there is in light grey, the text "Scan Copyright (c) MoHPC". a little odd for a manual being genuinely published by hp?

addendum: LOL, looks like katie spotted it at the same time as me!

Edited: 18 July 2011, 2:40 p.m.

[Eric Rechlin]

Quote:

---

look at the bottom of the third page of the pdf, there is in light grey, the text "Scan Copyright (c) MoHPC". a little odd for a manual being genuinely published by hp?

addendum: LOL, looks like katie spotted it at the same time as me!

---

Technically HP owns the copyright for the manual. I think it's a little obscene that the HP Museum tries to claim copyright.

Eric

[Steve Simpkin]

From the wording, I think the HP Museum Copyright is strictly for the scanning process. AFAIK, the HP Museum had permission to scan and re-distribute these manuals. I suspect that HP also reserved the right (either implied or explicitly) to use the scanned copies from the HP Museum as well.

[Eric Rechlin]

Quote:

---

From the wording, I think the HP Museum Copyright is strictly for the scanning process.

---

I am not a lawyer, but I believe this has no legal basis. If you take a photograph of a painting, you do not own copyright of the photograph because no original work was created. I don't know if there is case law to support this, but I would imagine the exact same thing would apply to scanning a painting (or a manual or whatever).

The HP Museum does not own the copyright of the PDF manuals for this reason. HP does, however, just like they have the copyright of the original manuals. HP is completely within their rights to distribute the scanned manuals that say "Copyright MoHPC", and it is entirely possible, if not likely, the MoHPC is violating federal law by claiming copyright here.

Eric

[Jim Yohe]

David Hicks wrote me not long ago for a somewhat related topic and said the museum had permission from HP to scan out of production calculator documentation.

[Gene Wright]

Hey Jim.

I think Eric's point isn't that HP did not give Dave permission to scan these old documents, but whether the Museum can claim copyright to them.

[Ivan Latorre]

Excellent news! Too many years have passed since the release of the 35s.

Me wants one!

[db (martinez, ca.)]

A constantly improving WP-34S and a new 15C both available now.

These are the good old days.

[Walter B]

Thank you :-)

[Massimo Gnerucci (Italy)]

Quote:

---

A constantly improving WP-34S and a new 15C both available now.

These are the good old days.

---

Right, not to mention 41-CL... ;)

Greetings,
Massimo

[db (martinez, ca.)]

How did i forget the 41cl? Sorry Monte!

When is the final version coming out? I have a 41 with a dead PCB waiting.

[Monte Dalrymple]

I don't have a schedule for when there might be another assembly batch.
You were on the list for one of the first twenty, but I never heard back
from you, so it went to someone else.

[db (martinez, ca.)]

I don't think i am qualified to be one of the beta testers. Better that someone who can give you both complaints and possible solutions got it first. I guess i should have said something.

I've probably been on your list since we sat next to each other at the San Jose HHC where you gave the talk. I can wait a bit longer, but i'm still anxious to get one.

[robertoataulfo]

Link Manual 15C LE?

[Peter Murphy (Livermore)]

1. It's in Japanese, I think.

2. It says (copyright) YHP 1983.

Probably not what we're hoping for.

[Patrice]

Looks like the manual is just a scan of the 1986 one.

Look at the batteries at the end.

Patrice

[Jim Yohe]

Pages 260-263

[Paul Dale]

I want....

- Pauli

[hpnut]

I want too, at HP 30B price :-)

[Walter B]

I dunno - I would really want it with Michael's display. But I may buy one if it's priced reasonably here.

Walter

[hpnut]

I want HP to keep it pure RPN, no AOS pls!

the recent models all have algebraic, the manuals suffer as a result of having to explain how to use the calculators in RPN and AOS modes.

p.s. heheh, having JTAG connectors is a good idea, too, to allow power users to "repurpose" the HP 15C :-)

[Ángel Martin]

Quote:

---

having JTAG connectors is a good idea, too, to allow power users to "repurpose" the HP 15C :-)

---

into a basic business calc perhaps? - LOL.

So how limited is limited edition?

[Dave Britten]

Quote:

---

So how limited is limited edition?

---

Probably depends on how many we buy, and how many more production runs they have to make to shut us up.

[Michael de Estrada]

Until there is some hard evidence that this is actually happening, it could just be a hoax. All we have is an unverified image that could just be the result of good artwork. Remember the old saying "Don't count your chickens until they are hatched."

[hpnut]

Do you have the HP 67CX in mind? ;-)

http://209.197.117.170/item/product2.htm

[Martin Pinckney]

Where's Tim in all this? If it's true, he can't stay silent for too long.

[Michael de Estrada]

Exactly. Which is why I'm skeptical.

[Jim Yohe]

I was thinking the same thing. He's been pretty silent on it.

[Tim Wessman]

What do I need to chime in about?

I'm just sitting back enjoying the whole show. :-)

TW

Edited: 18 July 2011, 1:26 p.m.

[Glenn Dowdy]

Yeah, quiet is as quiet does.

[Jim Yohe]

Just watching on the sidelines as the speculation mill churns ... :-)

[Steve Simpkin]

Well if it is a hoax, it is a very good one.

If you go to HP's Customer Care website at "www.hp.com/cposupport/eschome.html" and type "HP-15C" (without the quotes) in the product location box, you will be sent to HP's HP-15C support page. The product picture shows the "Limited Edition" text under the name badge. Here you can also download a scanned color English copy of the HP-15C Owner's Handbook (dated June 1987).

Again if this is a hoax, it is an inside job on HP's North American and Japanese websites.


Thank you Lyuka for posting this information.

[Scott Newell]

Quote:

---

Well if it is a hoax, it is a very good one.

---

My thought as well.

Maybe I'm remembering wrong, but haven't the last few calc introductions shown up in places like Amazon *before* the HP website? Seems strange that this time the website would actually be up to date (or even correct)!

[Mike T.]

Interesting - I wonder how long before the rest of the rest of the world gets them...? I want one!

A long time ago one a chap I know at University moved to Japan and as a result we lost touch - perhaps it is time to renew his acquaintance..?

Though the 15c appears to have its own page but doesn't feature on the page listing all the available models, though as I don't read Japanese it is hard to tell what is what..

Mike T.

Edited: 18 July 2011, 11:51 a.m.

[Peter Murphy (Livermore)]

HP corporate switchboard told me this:

* Call HP at 1-800-752-0900.

* Ask (by voice prompt) for presales information and/or product information.

* Stay on the line and do what you must to speak to a human.

I did all that.

The human hadn't heard this news. I gave him the first of the two URLs in NateB's 17 July 2:26 p.m. message. He put me on hold for a while and returned with this:

Yes it was released in Japan yesterday 17 July. No, he has product information only, not prices, not even of US products and definitely not on this. He has no information regarding possible release in the USA.

If it becomes available in the USA, however, pricing and ordering information thereon will be at the Home Office (HO): 1-888-999-4747.

And have a great day, he says.

[Martin Pinckney]

Then I suppose we will hear from Tim soon. Or not. HP has some strange ways...

[Tim Wessman]

There is no 15c launched in Japan, or anywhere else.

TW

[Glenn Dowdy]

Especially with bad pi.

[NateB]

Emulator then? That was my original thought...

[Martin Pinckney]

Maybe Peter Murphy (Livermore) is in on the 'hoax'?

[Jim Yohe]

April Fools is three months past ...

[Lyuka]

Dear Tim,

Quote:

---

There is no 15c launched in Japan, or anywhere else.

---

Of course, not yet.

It's going to be launched in the near future, you mean, right ? ;-)

Lyuka

[Martin Pinckney]

If you put the URL of the first site NateB cited into Google Translate, it says the web page is in the Chinese language (even though the address has ja in it).

The translation does not yield much, but at the bottom it says:

©2011 Hewlett-Packard Development Company

So I am speculating (like everyone else here except Tim) that what NateB found is some sort of internal HP site (or masquerading to be one) related to product development. Which is why it's in Chinese. {:-)

Edited: 18 July 2011, 2:11 p.m.

[Michael de Estrada]

Well, a few weeks ago I had my 65th birthday, and with the government threatning to cut back or eliminate Medicare, I'm not sure how much longer I have to go on this earth. I've decided to specify in my will that my HP-15C is to be buried with me, which should help keep prices up on TAS.

[Lyuka]

It is all written in not Chinese but Japanese.

#Google Translate must learn CJK more.

Lyuka

[Martin Pinckney]

Quote:

---

It is all written in not Chinese but Japanese.

#Google Translate must learn CJK more.

---

It's all 'Greek' to me.

[Martin Pinckney]

Quote:

---

It is all written in not Chinese but Japanese.

---

Lyuka, since you can read it, tell us what is says, please.

[Eric Rechlin]

Quote:

---

Lyuka, since you can read it, tell us what is says, please.

---

I can't read either Chinese or Japanese but I know enough about the characters used in the two languages to say that this is definitely Japanese. Chinese doesn't use katakana, which some of the characters on that page are.

Eric

[Brandon Poindexter]

Can anyone tell my how the page was actually found? I mean you go to hp.jp , pull down their drop down menu and select "PDA & (Japanese chars. for calculator)", but they have no actual listing published for the hp 15c.

[Lyuka]

The guy at a BBS in Japan who found the page said (like this in Japanese),

Quote:

---

The following pages were found while examining the specs of

the 30b and the 10bII+, thinking about buying something new,

'cause there are no further information about the 15C(Limited edition) .

http://www8.hp.com/jp/ja/products/calculators/index.html

---

It must be a kind of serendipity :-)

Lyuka

[Frank Rottgardt]

Evidence for pending HP 15c relaunch dated April 2011

[Walter B]

Hallo Frank, this source was discussed here some months earlier already. Please search the archive.

[Walter B]

Ok, congratulations, the pictures are well made. The golden print color just slightly off, like on some newer 12Cs. And the font employed for "Limited Edition" is one only US-Americans would use, so it looked pretty plausible to me.

Walter

[Steve Simpkin]

Walter,

Don't give up quite yet. Tim may just be playing word games with us noting that "There is no 15c launched in Japan, or anywhere else.", YET!

As Lyuka pointed out, the "Limited Edition" HP-15C image is shown on HP's North American and their Japanese websites.

Steve

[Thomas Radtke]

I'm sure Tim wouldn't be part of the game if the actual announcement wouldn't follow soon.

Will we again manage to find a US-dealer willing to ship that thing to Germany? :-)

Edited: 19 July 2011, 1:42 p.m.

[Walter B]

Hallo Thomas, if it will take some time still, maybe the usual HP exchange rate taking 1,0 € for 1.0 $ may turn favourable for us - once ;-)

[Ángel Martin]

Quote:

---

There is no 15c launched in Japan, or anywhere else.

---

Too bad then, I guess we'll flock to the clone and will give him the business instead.

[Don Shepherd]

Quote:

---

Too bad then, I guess we'll flock to the clone and will give him the business instead.

---

I wouldn't worry too much about HP. I'm sure their sales of 12c's are about a billion times what the sales of a 15c reissue would be.

[Reth]

Exactly! Now whoever brings it on the market first, wins. I'd still buy the clone though, there is a word given ;)

[Bart (UK)]

This could be a ploy by HP to play legal cat-and-mouse, asserting their wish to still produce 15C's to have legal clout to stop the clones entering the market (e.g. considering "copyright and fair use" - would the clone impact HPs market? One could argue not if they weren't going to make any more).

Note: I am just throwing some thoughts into the midst. I am not really knowledgeable about legal issues. Just speculating.

[Bart (UK)]

And one could argue that "announced" does not equal "launched" :-)

[Thomas Radtke]

Quote:

---

And one could argue that "announced" does not equal "launched" :-)

---

One could argue that a 15c is not a 15C ;-).

[Mike Morrow]

Or a HP-15C is not a HP 15C.

[Maarten Ambaum (Reading, UK)]

Quote:

---

Here, and on the second page, here

---

That first link now stopped pointing to the15C information. What's going on? HP marketing surely know how to screw up a product launch ...

[NateB]

All information has been scrubbed. Lyuka's posts are hot-linking the images of the calculator. I wonder how long those will stay up...

[Victor Quiros]

Friends, I'm afraid we'll still have to wait from 6 - 12 months to have a definite word on this eventual release, which I truly *wish* :-). Kind regards from San José, Costa Rica.

[Joerg Woerner]

Please check HP Japan's Job Offer postings.

I bet they are searching a new Intern for their product management / web-store ;-))

Cheers,
Joerg

[hpnut]

sigh, i think someone is pulling off a big time hoax on us. I am disappointed :-(

[JustinM]

I don't think this was a hoax. I successfully ran the page through Google Translate before it was removed. It was in Japanese. It was an incomplete product page, with sections for specs and features that were empty. It looked like a rough draft of a web page that was accidentally made accessible on the public internet.

Had the image shown up on some sketchy server or a Chinese rumor site then I'd be more inclined to think the "Limited Edition" logo was photoshopped. The fact that the image was hosted on an actual HP web site gives it a lot more credibility. The colors do look a bit off, the 'f' key is crooked, and pi is truncated instead of rounded, but it could be a prototype with a number typed into the display. As far as the display goes (including the contrast), it could easily have been simulated.

I think this (and the smaller version of this image on the US HP site) just verifies that a re-release will happen, but I wouldn't read anything into the product quality or try to predict timing yet.

Edited: 22 July 2011, 12:16 p.m. after one or more responses were posted

[hpnut]

thanks, Justin.

you are raising my hopes again :-)

hpnut in Malaysia

[NateB]

I have screen captures of the pages before they were taken down if anyone is interested. It was on HP's Japanese site. Also, Google still has the cached images available.

I also managed to dig up the spec sheet for the upcoming 30th Anniversary Edition 12c from the HP website. The part number format for the 12c (NW258AA) matches the part number format listed for the Limited Edition 15c (NW250AA). Also, the values of pi displayed on the 12c are the same as those on the 15...

The 15c and 12c are also starting to show up on vendor sites. Here is an example. List price of $85.00 :)

Edited: 23 July 2011, 12:07 p.m.

[DaveJ]

I haven't been on here in a long time it seems.
(forgive me for not reading the entire thread...)
So this is real? HP have finally released a 15C, presumably based on the new ARM architecture just like I and others predicted?
(how long ago was that, and how far were we out by? :->)

Dave.

[db (martinez, ca.)]

No one is sure it's real. Tim says it's not. That should mean something, but someone finds wiggle-room in his statement. We may still be waiting for you to build one that straps to a wrist.

Have you been following the WP-34S?

[DaveJ]

Quote:

---

No one is sure it's real. Tim says it's not. That should mean something, but someone finds wiggle-room in his statement. We may still be waiting for you to build one that straps to a wrist.

---

Tim had two choices here.
1) Say nothing (which people would usually take no response as being true)
2) Say something (which would have to tow the company line and quell any rumors, but not confirm it). I see he did that nicely ;-)

If it was on the HP Japan site, then it's true. Doesn't mean they can't can it last minute though. But if it made the site, then it's probably gone to far and is likely imminent.

Quote:

---

Have you been following the WP-34S?

---

Just noticed that.
Can someone give me a quick low-down?
I gathered it's a firmware/decal/key set to turn a 20B financial into a scientific?
They keys were always the bugbear, how was that solved?

Dave.

[Paul Dale]

Quote:

---

Can someone give me a quick low-down?

---

I got sick of waiting for a scientific calculator I wanted to use so I wrote my own. Walter joined up very early to direct the layout and write the manual. Marcus joined earlier this year.

Quote:

---

I gathered it's a firmware/decal/key set to turn a 20B financial into a scientific?

---

Exactly. The sourceforge site has the code and pre-compiled binaries.

Quote:

---

They keys were always the bugbear, how was that solved?

---

By the 30b :-) The 20b's key are unchanged. The 30b, however, has a much nicer keyboard. It really is fairly pleasant to use and it uses the same internals.

- Pauli

[DaveJ]

Quote:

---

By the 30b :-) The 20b's key are unchanged. The 30b, however, has a much nicer keyboard. It really is fairly pleasant to use and it uses the same internals.

---

So these keys are just stickers?

Looks awesome!

Hows the longevity on those?

Dave.

Edited: 23 July 2011, 7:41 a.m.

[Paul Dale]

I'm not aware of anyone having worn them out yet.

Time will tell.

- Pauli

[DaveJ]

Quote:

---

We may still be waiting for you to build one that straps to a wrist.

---

Well, things have changed since I was last on here.

I'm now a full time video blogger, so in theory I should have a lot more time to spend on projects like the uWatch2 and the uCalc.

But somehow, I haven't!

It might be this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzrtEYmuQJQ

But you never know, that calc watch fetish might emerge again!

Dave.

[Paul Dale]

Quote:

---

I'm now a full time video blogger, so in theory I should have a lot more time to spend on projects like the uWatch2 and the uCalc.

---

Great stuff. Long time coming...

Quote:

---

It might be this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzrtEYmuQJQ

---

These will do it every time.

Congratulations. No time for many many years to come :)

- Pauli

[DaveJ]

I found this google cached page for HP India:

LINK

And it says you get a "product CD with virtual calculator" in the box.

And this supplier actually lists it!

http://www.synnex.com/vendors/HEWLETT_PACKARD_CALCULATORS.html

Dave.

Edited: 23 July 2011, 7:49 a.m.

[Katie Wasserman]

I don't think it's a question mark for long. There's a documentation link on
HP's USA site

-Katie

Edited: 23 July 2011, 9:51 a.m.

[DaveJ]

Quote:

---

I don't think it's a question mark for long. There's a documentation link on
HP's USA site

---

Looks like they have removed it.

Dave.

[bill platt]

Note the "page not found" has replaced it :-(

[Eric Smith]

Operating an e-commerce web site doesn't appear to be one of HP's core competencies. They routinely fail to have information about shipping products, or fail to allow purchasing them, but then they do have information about unannounced products.

They should outsource their web site to Amazon or something.

[Thomas Radtke]

A non-working information flow is rarely corrected by adding another components, imo. My company just introduced XML to get rid of some sources of problems :-). If anything fails, it happens where still word is used or something like web pages are manually edited. It is highly interesting how huge amounts of information can be successfully interpreted by very simple stylesheets and a few php scripts to get everything needed to put out one or two more or less new machines each day.

It takes only a handfull of technical writers to do it right. No need to outsource anything.

[Eric Smith]

The HP web site problems don't appear to have anything to do with the technical writers.

It wouldn't be "adding another components", it would be replacing one set of components with another.

I've certainly seen plenty of outsourcing projects fail miserably, but I've also seen web and e-commerce sites outsourced to industry-leading companies with great results.

[Thomas Radtke]

Quote:

---

I've certainly seen plenty of outsourcing projects fail miserably, but I've also seen web and e-commerce sites outsourced to industry-leading companies with great results.

---

Yes, it all depends on the kind of information to present. If you offer a shop and handle annoncements, you have to connect your data source somehow to another company.

In the best case, only raw data as collected is maintained and everything is derived from it in time. You wouldn't want to provide a selective copy of your raw data to anyone, as this would mean to integrate and maintain one addition component. I'm talking about safety here.

Synchronizing general changes is another problem to be solved. It's far easier to do this in a meeting than to transport all necessary information to another party.

BTW, don't underestimate the scope of technical writers. They don't just write. Actually, sometimes they even don't write at all. The german term for it translates to 'technical editor', which is more to the point.