The following warnings occurred:
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184012 - Line: 275 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 275 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184019 - Line: 275 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 275 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184034 - Line: 275 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 275 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184040 - Line: 275 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 275 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184058 - Line: 275 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 275 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184064 - Line: 275 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 275 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184073 - Line: 275 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 275 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184080 - Line: 275 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 275 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184085 - Line: 275 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 275 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184087 - Line: 275 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 275 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184093 - Line: 275 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 275 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184140 - Line: 275 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 275 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184158 - Line: 275 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 275 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined variable $thread - Line: 295 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 295 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Trying to access array offset on value of type null - Line: 295 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 295 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined variable $fid - Line: 295 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 295 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184080 - Line: 331 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 331 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 304 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184158 - Line: 331 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 331 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 304 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184093 - Line: 331 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 331 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 304 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined array key 184064 - Line: 331 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 331 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 332 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 304 ThreadedMode::buildtree
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined variable $theme - Line: 3 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php(305) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php(305) : eval()'d code 3 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 305 eval
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Trying to access array offset on value of type null - Line: 3 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php(305) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php(305) : eval()'d code 3 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 305 eval
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined variable $theme - Line: 3 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php(305) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php(305) : eval()'d code 3 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 305 eval
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Trying to access array offset on value of type null - Line: 3 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php(305) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php(305) : eval()'d code 3 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 305 eval
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Undefined variable $lang - Line: 5 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php(305) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php(305) : eval()'d code 5 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 305 eval
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks
Warning [2] Attempt to read property "messages_in_thread" on null - Line: 5 - File: inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php(305) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.14 (Linux)
File Line Function
/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php(305) : eval()'d code 5 errorHandler->error_callback
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 305 eval
/inc/plugins/threaded_mode.php 23 ThreadedMode::showthread_threaded
/inc/class_plugins.php 142 threaded_mode_showthread_threaded
/showthread.php 918 pluginSystem->run_hooks





Simulation vs Emulation



#2

I found this forum on accident and read an archived thread with the same title as this one. There was no consensus overall in the thread and many good points were made in the argument. It was interesting. My contribution (though late) would be to say:

Despite the medium through which results are delivered (physics, hardware, software, etc…) a simulator produces the exact same expected results and an emulator is differentiated by also producing the exact same unexpected results. Oh to Error!


#3

The difference between simulation and emulation reminds me of the difference between Dementia and Alzheimer's disease.

I like writing calculator emulators because they give me more freedom on how to mimic commands.

Namir


#4

Carl, I like your statement. :-)

In a simulation, you can easily extend the bounds of the original system, be it speed, memory or function set. See Free42 for a good example. But it's a lot of work to implement the original functionality so that the emulator behaves as a superset of the original system and not as a subset with extensions.

In an emulation, you have other problems: You cannot easily extend the bounds of the original hardware like speed or memory because the original firmware needs to be patched to recognize the new possibilities. Keyboard scan or display are examples where an unmodified firmware needs a relatively exact emulation of the original hardware to work reliably. You cannot easily add a dot matrix display to a 15C without severe changes to the old system.


#5

Well, for the HP-15C emulation I think you should be able to add an alphanumeric display and use it to show in program mode the instruction name instead of the keycode, without patching the original firmware.

[Edited to replace simulation by emulation]

Edited: 12 May 2011, 2:48 a.m. after one or more responses were posted


#6

interesting you say that, as i've thought over the same thing - a 15c with a dot-matrix display ability PURELY for showing the instruction mnemonics). if the code that displays that data on screen was well compartmentized in the original code, a simulator could substitute it's own alpha-driving routine when it was jumped to.

has anyone sat down and tried to disassemble (at least partially) the original 15c roms back into the original assembly code?


#7

I don't think you need to look at the original code, an emulator should already have a routine to drive the physical display, so it "knows" the state of the display. When the PRGM indicator is on it can interpret the keycodes and replace them by the mnemonics.


#8

good point - that would (as far as i can see) work, and add a great deal to the 'user experience' of the calculator with very little programming effort beyond writing the initial 10-series simulator.

#9

Quote:
has anyone sat down and tried to disassemble (at least partially) the original 15c roms back into the original assembly code?

Yes.


#10

Quote:
Yes.



:-)
#11

Quote:
Well, for the HP-15C emulation I think you should be able to add an alphanumeric display and use it to show in program mode the instruction name instead of the keycode, without patching the original firmware.
By evaluating the display driver and subsequent transformations? Interesting.

#12

Carl,

Quote:
Quote:
Well, for the HP-15C emulation I think you should be able to add an alphanumeric display and use it to show in program mode the instruction name instead of the keycode, without patching the original firmware.
By evaluating the display driver and subsequent transformations? Interesting.

It's quite obvious some of us have difficulties with these terms as well ;-) Help: The "WP 34S Emulator" is exactly this :-)

Walter


#13

Quote:
It's quite obvious some of us have difficulties with these terms as well ;-) Help: The "WP 34S Emulator" is exactly this :-)
What was the reason to quote me on this?
#14

From what I understand, the traditional definition is/was thus:

Simulation - software-based facsimile

Emulation - hardware-based facsimile

But in the past 15 or so years, it seems to have shifted somewhat:

Simulation - A reimplementation designed for some subset of compatibility with the original, usually at a somewhat high or superficial level

Emulation - A software implementation of the lowest-level details of something, allowing comatibility to kind of fall into place on top of that fundamental layer of functionality


Possibly Related Threads…
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  HP-70 Simulation for iPhone Willy R. Kunz 2 1,449 11-17-2013, 07:12 AM
Last Post: Namir
  Question about Simulation Namir 7 2,321 09-12-2013, 08:02 PM
Last Post: Namir
  Last HP emulation, 32 & 01 Olivier De Smet 0 1,005 09-07-2013, 08:27 AM
Last Post: Olivier De Smet
  HP 50G emulation for android Olivier De Smet 3 1,720 04-14-2013, 12:01 PM
Last Post: CompSystems
  Virtual HP-IL 40 col. video interface simulation Christoph Giesselink 10 3,125 08-19-2012, 06:46 PM
Last Post: Richard Wagoner
  New HP71B emulation (go71b) Olivier De Smet 9 3,302 06-26-2012, 10:25 AM
Last Post: Jerry Raia
  USB-41 82143A simulation update: MAN-TRACE modes Diego Diaz 0 973 06-09-2012, 08:46 PM
Last Post: Diego Diaz.
  HP-41 > USB printer simulation (82143A) Diego Diaz 25 6,390 02-17-2012, 06:38 PM
Last Post: Diego Diaz
  Re: Voyager 1xC emulation in the same unit? uhmgawa 4 2,076 01-24-2012, 01:09 AM
Last Post: uhmgawa
  Emulator updates & HP82240B printer simulation Christoph Giesselink 14 4,056 10-28-2011, 05:26 AM
Last Post: Nick_S

Forum Jump: