Another non-HP RPN calculator in my collection



#36

I just won a TAS auction for an apparently NOS Garrett 2002 There was one other serious bidder, perhaps someone who frequents this forum? The listing made no mention of RPN, otherwise there might have been more bidders. This is the second Garrett I've found, the first being a model 2000, which differs only in that it lacks the alarm clock & timer functions. I find it interesting that the instructions for the Garrett 2000 make no mention of RPN, even though the calc has an Enter key and clearly uses RPN data entry. Anyways, lately my collecting has been focused on non-HP RPN calcs.


#37

Interesting - I didn't bid on this item, but the first (non-serious) bidder for your Garrett is currently going hard on an auction that i'm trying to win (and it's not an HP, which is unusual for me). Cheers, Keith


#38

Were you aware that the Garrett uses RPN ? Is the calc you are currently bidding on RPN ? My focus is mainly RPN, although I do own non-RPN calcs as well, about 25% of the total. The majority of all my calcs, about 60%, are HP.

Anyways, good luck on the auction, and let us know what it is after it's over.

Michael

Edited: 23 Feb 2011, 12:32 a.m. after one or more responses were posted


#39

No it's an obscure 1970's non-RPN scientific calculator - I have an interest in the particular brand of this one, but for no rational reason (other than my 5 year old son shares the same name and he now has one in 'his' collection - scary what i've started!!).

I hadn't heard of Garrett before this post. There aren't too many non-HP RPN calcs out there.

I think 75% of my collection is HP, 15% would be Sharp pocket computers and the balance are other 'obscure' general interest calculators (like a TI SR-10, Casio FX-702P with ABCDEF keyboard layout, etc). I actually don't have any RPN calculators that aren't HP. Cheers, Keith

Edited: 23 Feb 2011, 12:04 a.m.


#40

Quote:
There aren't too many non-HP RPN calcs out there.

Actually, there are quite a few, although most are no longer made.

non-HP RPN calculators


#41

Haha - maybe I should have said "There aren't too many non-HP RPN calcs out there that I know of". That's quite an impressive collection. Mind you, does anything else RPN quite compare to a HP? Keith


#42

I hope I didn't give the impression that the collection is mine; I could only dream that it were. It belongs to db (his initials), who is a frequent contributor to this forum, and very much a calculator insider. Indeed, were it not for db, I would not be aware of many of these non-HP calculators, which are largely original designs. As to your question regarding HP .vs. others in regards to RPN, mostly HP is king, but there are others that compare favorably or even surpass HP at the time they were produced. For example, the Corvus 500 introduced hyperbolic functions in the late 1970's before the HP-32E, and the quality was much higher than the HP Spice series.


#43

Quote:
...the Corvus 500 introduced hyperbolic functions in the late 1970's before the HP-32E...

Is that a milestone for RPN calcs only? The TI SR-51 has hyperbolic functions, and it came out in very early 1975.


#44

There's a Corvus 500 for sale at the evil auction site right now. - Not by me! I have nothing to do with it.
It's a BIN with a high price but the seller is honest and the cost is what i paid for mine with shipping from England in 2003.
It's one of my three or four favorite non-hp RPNs, really well implemented.


#45

The BIN was lowered from a higher price. It's now a bit lower than I paid for mine, however, mine is in mint condition, whereas the one in the auction has a lot of wear of the gold printed legends above the keys, and several are missing completely. If anyone on this forum buys it, I can send you a pdf of the owner's manual. There was also an APF mark 55, but I don't see it anymore.

#46

Quote:
Actually, there are quite a few, although most are no longer made.

Aside from the 12C clones, I can't think of any non-HP RPN calculators still in production. Do you know of any?


#47

I'm only aware of the Victor V12, which is an HP-12C Platinum clone. I think the last original non-HP RPN calcs were the Elektronikas, which were made until about 1993 in Ukraine as Soviet branded models.


#48

Semico in Novosibirsk, Russia, still makes the Elektronika line. The most recent additions are the MK 152 and the MK 161.

They even have a website: www.semico.ru

You might need to run it through Google translate since they don't have an English version (assuming you don't speak or read Russian).

Regards,

Mark


#49

Thanks!

MK-161 - 4700 rubles

MK-152 - 3800 rubles

I have a MK-61 , which is very similar


Edited: 23 Feb 2011, 4:30 p.m.

#50

Quote:
Anyways, good luck on the auction, and let us know what it is after it's over
Hi Michael, it was a Lloyd's Accumatic 321. I have a few Lloyd's in my collection now - nice quality. Cheers, Keith
#51

I believe my dad had a Garrett 2000 when I was growing up. On the back, does it have a sticker that says something to the effect of:

"This calculator will take you to the year 2000 and beyond"?

Dave


#52

There are several stickers on the back, but none with such a statement. The instruction pamphlet states "THE CLASSIC 2000....A Calculator for the year 2000....available in the 1970's." It then promotes the advantages of RPN entry, without ever actually using the word RPN, "The CLASSIC 2000 is easier to operate than any other calculator. Once the original figure is entered, all further additions, substractions, multiplications or divisions can be performed with one key depression for each step; this process can continue indefinitely."


#53

Wonder how they did it with an infinite stack in 1970??


#54

Well, I'm sure you are being facetious, but it's just a 2-level stack that cannot be pushed up past the second level, since only the initial depression of the Enter key raises the stack. After that it acts as the + operator. Repeated consecutive operations without further number entry has no effect. Also the - key acts as Enter initially, only it enters the number as a negative value, which is equivalent to Enter and Chs (+/-). Still, they are correct that a calculation such as (3+5)*4 will require fewer keystrokes than on an algebraic entry calculator.


#55

The top ten coolest things about the Garrett 2000 series:
10)Real Hardwood
9)Finest keys ever put into a calculator
8)Made in the United States of America
7)RPN
6)RPN
5)RPN
4)RPN
3)RPN
2)RPN
1)RPN


#56

i did not quite understood the "cool thing" number 8. could you explain?


#57

Olá Navarro,

comprendo que não comprendes. Estam estados um poquinho especiais ... vocês deviam comparar "Made in Great Britain" em 1910 ;-)

Cumprimentos,
Walter

(For our unilingual readers: Answered Navarro's question with an historic example.)

Edited: 26 Feb 2011, 2:03 a.m.


#58

Hello Walter,

Could you please repeat in English?

Regards.

#59

Wanderley,

Many people take pride in things made in their native land. Americans (which is how residents of the USA refer to themselves, w/o intending any offense to Canadians, Mexicans Central or S. Americans) in particular are proud of our manufacturing heritage. At one time, we made the best of everything (or so we thought).

That is, except for cars (Germany), cameras (once Germany, then Japan), fine china (England), consumer electronics (Japan), fine leather goods (Italy), fine wines (France), ...

Anyway, having lost most manufacturing to Japan, Korea, Mexico, and China, Americans nowadays particularity appreciate stuff "Made in USA."


#60

... which has an historic parallel in the British Empire some 100 years ago. Great Britain, having been the mother of industrialisation in the 19th century, introduced the "Made in ..." tag (with the intention of highlighting other country's producers making lower quality, so proud British won't buy from them) at the very time it was losing its leadership in the industrial world.

Lesson learned: The value of "Made in X" is based on the quality produced in a particular industry in this country X at a particular time, not vice versa. Note this statement is time and industry dependent.

Corrolary 1: The absolute, constant pride in "Made in X" for an arbitrary country X, without checking the necessary boundary conditions (was quality really as good in this industry there at that time, and is it still?), is just hollow words.

Corrolary 2: The disqualification of particular countries as producers of "cheap ... crap" was often nothing more than the sound going along with the rise of these countries (think of Japan, Taiwan some years ago, maybe China now).

HTH


#61

Quote:
Corrolary 2: The disqualification of particular countries as producers of "cheap ... crap" was often nothing more than the sound going along with the rise of these countries (think of Japan, Taiwan some years ago, maybe China now).

Quite true. Although, there was, as in most cases of bias such as you have described, a kernel of truth.

For instance, the "cheap crap from Japan" moniker came about in the 1950s at a time when Japan was indeed exporting huge quantities of cheap consumer products to the U.S., as a conscious decision. This was considered the best way to crack into the U.S. market, given post-war bias. All the while, Japan was producing cameras and electronics of unsurpassed quality, known only to the lucky few.

The same has been true of China, only in a different time period and with a slightly different story. Aside from the early years of copying German cameras, Japan has been an innovator. China, OTOH, typically still produces under western specifications, IMO.

#62

Quote:
i did not quite understood the "cool thing" number 8. could you explain?



A bit of nationalism. I think it was justifiable in this case. While there have been some truly great RPN calculators made in Russia, Germany, Argentina, Great Britain & Hong Kong --- HP, Garrett, Friden and Heathkit made their stuff here on the left coast of the U.S.

Would it have been been more palatable if i had said "8) Made in California"? That actually sounds more cool to me, but the east coast contingent here may not agree. -yea i'm takin a you Katie!

#63

Great!!

I was perfectly aware of everything was said and my goal was to provoque the debate.

I'm pretty sure db didn't had the "intention" to disqualify any country but since this is an international place of excellent & high level discussions and exchange of ideas with lots of comradeship between members, one should keep in mind that his distracted words can hurt someone proud even without having the intention.

Is not my case however... I know Brazil is not THAT tech country (but we made very good HP-97s, 41CVs and Voyagers among others here at the time).

I'm a quality lover so personally like almost everything made in the USA, Germany or Japan.

Thanks all.


#64

Quote:
i did not quite understood the "cool thing" number 8. could you explain?


I was perfectly aware of everything was said and my goal was to provoque the debate.

I suspected as much, but decided to take you literally and explain, not what db meant, but what I take the appeal of "Made in USA" to be.
Quote:
I'm pretty sure db didn't had the "intention" to disqualify any country... one should keep in mind that his distracted words can hurt someone proud even without having the intention.

I fail to see how any such expression is hurtful. I would not take offense at a Brazilian being proud of something excellent made there.

Women, for instance. {:-)


#65

Quote:
I fail to see how any such expression is hurtful.

May be a bit tricky to see indeed...

Although I do not have the intention to polemize too much, perhaps the point becomes clearer when one realizes the difference between proud and vainglorious (boastful) about his country's excellence.

There is on the later a proactive attitude that makes the talker discourteous (inelegant) and unsympathetic (obnoxious) when addressing to an international audience.

Unless of course the audience is from buddies and the statement intentionally said for fun... but in this case the intention must be perfectly clear...


#66

Quote:
Could you please repeat in English?


#67

Please see above. Or with an old saying here: "Don't throw stones while sitting in a greenhouse!"

#68

Quote:
i did not quite understood the "cool thing" number 8. could you explain?

vs.

I was perfectly aware of everything was said and my goal was to provoque the debate.

I suspected you wanted to provoke, especially after you asked for an English translation d;-) Since the story of the British inventing "Made in Germany" may not be common knowledge, however, I decided to explain this once more. Everything else in this matter is written above already.

Anyway, the majority of forumers come from one country inhabited by many people with unbroken self-confidence (or call it nationalism), so challenges like this are fun sometimes.

I close concurring with Martin: Enjoy the quality of Brazilian products! d:-)

#69

Some years ago I dedided to bought an HP-12C to celebrate the 20th anniversaire. I found on TAS a buyer from Corvallis selling a NOS. I thought it was the right one. When it arrived I confirmed it was perfect. But even coming from Corvallis it was Made in Brazil.

#70

Well, I got the Garrett 2002 that I won in the TAS auction today and it's doa. It was working before it shipped, and there's no evidence of shipping damage, but it's totally dead now. No display whatsoever when I switch it on, but power is getting to the circuit board, because I read 120 vac where the wall cord connects to the circuit board and there's this big transformer that gets hot. I don't see any evidence of fried components, circuit traces all look good, soldered connections look good, etc. Maybe a capacitor is bad? Well, anyways, hopefully it's something that can be fixed, otherwise it's just a large paperweight. Bummer!


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