Texas HP Module $$$$



#2

Who wrote that Texas is not valued in relationship HP's?

RPN Module Link

TI-59 Link

Texas TI58/58C/59 LIVE !!!

Great Joerg !!!!

Edited: 29 Sept 2009, 11:54 a.m.


#3

Holy @#$% ! Years ago there was someone here that was sending out HP calculators with TI calculators used as "packing material"!


#4

Guilty


#5

Thanks, Tom. I remember now. It's ok... most of those TI's can be bought for just a couple of bucks now. Still funny as hell.

#6

I didn't know (and still wouldn't believe it if I didn't saw the pictures in Joerg's auction) that TI produced an RPN simulator module. Doing that, TI acknowledged that RPN is superior to AOS, otherwise there would not be any need of such a module. Really amazing!

- Juergen


#7

Quote:
Doing that, TI acknowledged that RPN is superior to AOS, otherwise there would not be any need of such a module. Really amazing!

Not so! All that they really acknowledged was that there were some hardheads out there in HP land, and they might make some sales with an RPN option. That is similar to what HP did when they offered an algebraic option with the HP-33s and HP-35s.


#8

You are probably right; I'm just too much a techie guy than a marketing guy. But from the winning bid on eBay I conclude that this module is rare, so TI didn't sell many of them. Perhaps they missed the point that an efficient method like RPN also needs a quality keyboard to really be useful.

- Juergen


#9

Quote:
... an efficient method like RPN also needs a quality keyboard to really be useful.

What RPN really needed in those days was a credible power supply design.
#10

very true Jürgen and it seems that HP have long forgotten about this requirement.

Edited: 2 Oct 2009, 12:13 a.m.

#11

Quote:
That is similar to what HP did when they offered an algebraic option with the HP-33s and HP-35s.

HP has done a much better job of producing algebraic logic calculators (including those that "swing both ways") than TI did for RPN with this module for the TI-59. AFAIK, it's TI's only attempt at any type of RPN capability.

I remember when these modules were announced. IIRC, the MIT Coop carried them, as well as a few other places in the Boston area. I never knew anyone who bought one. I had a HP-67 in addition to a TI-59.

A computer geek friend and I were intrigued by the TI Algebraic Operating System, since it seemed to have some characteristics of a line-by-line interpreter/compiler. Each "statement" would need internally to be parsed and converted to stack or register operations like RPN. It seemed to be a technically sophisticated way (like RPL) to make simple things complex.


#12

IIRC, the HP 9820 desktop calculator (there is information about it here at the MoHPC) accepts algebraic programs and formulas from the user. It even allows for implied multiplication, such as 2ab+3a. But, internally, it converts all to RPN, and stores the program in RPN syntax. When the user wants to read, edit or list a program, the RPN code is "decompiled" to show it in the algebraic way.


#13

Yes, it's true that the HP 9820 is algebraic. The HP 9820 was the first HP calculator I ever used. It was employed as a logic board controller in an early digital systems class at Georgia Tech in the early 1970s.

I have a complete but non-working HP 9820 that I bought for $10 a decade ago, just for nostalgia. It's impressively built.

Thus, HP has some long-time expertise with algebraic calculators. OTOH, TI has never made any RPN calculators (except this weak module).


#14

Quote:
TI has never made any RPN calculators (except this weak module)

Mike, I doubt TI has any regrets about not entering the RPN market. I suspect they make more money from the TI-83 alone than HP makes from all their calculators.

#15

Juergen wrote:

    I didn't know (and still wouldn't believe it if I didn't saw the pictures in Joerg's auction) that TI produced an RPN simulator module. Doing that, TI acknowledged that RPN is superior to AOS, otherwise there would not be any need of such a module.

Wrong in both counts.

First, this wasn't an "RPN simulator" in the sense I think you're assuming it to be, i.e., a module which would allow you to perform RPN operations from the keyboard and such, as if you were using an HP-25 or HP-67, say, to perform some casual calculations.

Nothing of the sort. What this TI module did was accept an RPN program written for the HP-67/97, which you would enter as the corresponding numeric keycodes (say 31 25 00 for "LABEL 0" or 35 64 for "ABS"), and it would then convert said RPN program to the equivalent TI-58/TI-59 program, which would then be output to the mandatory printer for you to key it in.

Thus, it never simulated or made available RPN keyboard operations, it just accepted an RPN program for the HP-67/97 and converted it to the equivalent algebraic program for the TI-58/59, for you to enter it and then run it in the TI machine.

The point was clear: using this module, a TI user would have access to the vast library of excellent RPN programs made available for the HP-67/97, thus greatly expanding the library software for their machines by also taking advantage of those quality programs written for the other side.

I don't see this as proof that "TI acknowledged that RPN is superior to AOS", far from it. It actually was a very clever move by TI, even if the final results didn't meet the expectations.

Regards from V.

Edited: 2 Oct 2009, 5:29 a.m.


#16

Valentin,

Thanks for ghost-writing my comment ;-))

I just returned from a business trip and browsed the HP Forum. When I read this thread about my TI eBay auctions (BTW, a few months ago I sold a perfect, fully working but unboxed TI-59 for $315 to Asia), I thought about commenting the "Doing that, TI acknowledged that RPN is superior to AOS," statement.

But you did already. Thanks!

Regards,
Joerg


#17

Hi, Joerg:

    Thanks for your appreciation. I hadn't read or noticed your previous thread (i.e.: "db: You miss an important non-HP RPN calculator!") so I wasn't aware that this TI module's functionality had been discussed before.

    Quite on the contrary, after reading the fanboy-like comment by the other poster I assumed that he didn't know how it worked and what it did or didn't do, at all.

Have a nice weekend and regards from V.

#18

Thank you for clarification regarding the TI RPN module. I really thought it would simulate RPN input, because on the box it is advertised as 'RPN Simulator'. Making the huge HP program library available for TI-59 was really a good move and a comprehensible business decision. Anyway, one of my conclusions still hold: an efficient input method makes only sense together with a reliable keyboard. There are other RPN calculators (e.g., I have a Corvus 500), but I guess (I have no sales figures) they were not really successful because they lacked a quality keyboard.


#19

Jurgen;

The nearly perfect hp keyboard isn't everything.
This had a near-hp quality keyboard and was sold just across the border from you. It has the advantage of NOT having one of the two worst battery/charging systems imaginable: those found in the woodstock and spice series.
On the other hand; i may be overly forgiving of keyboard failings because i kind of like the keyboard on my Corvus, or maybe mine is from a different production run. I just wish it had those double shot hp keys. - db

#20

There was a thread on this last week (started by Joerg). Accessible here.


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