Byron Foster's 42s for iPhone v. 2 upgrade in App Store



#37

Subject line says it all. Much improved over v. 1, though I for one am looking for "the Original" from Thomas Okken himself, as though the fellow isn't under enough pressure already!

As an aside, Antonio Lagana has provided yet another update of i41cx+ with even more groovy features (though as an iPod touch user many of them I can't use!)

hope this is of interest to some.

Les


#38

It sure is!

Today is a good day: i41CX+, 42S RPN and PCalc RPN updates. 3 updated calcs to play with. Not bad.


#39

Now, if we could only get an updated 35s ! (Hitting head on brick wall)

Regards,

John

#40

Feedback/Issues:

  1. PRLCD fixed, however PRLCD only prints the top 2 rows in 4 line mode. I am unsure if graphics in 4 line mode have also been extended. Perhaps another can test.
  2. Import/export requires a WiFi connection so that it can act as an HTTP server. Given how spoiled I have been with i41CX+, this level of import/export is very minimal, however better than nothing.
  3. The new overlay labels are a nice touch. Very nice touch.
  4. Love the 4 line mode, however I am disappointed that the keyboard is not adjusted for 4 lines. IMHO, a different keyboard should be provided in 4 line mode. I can think of a number of ways to do this. E.g. smaller keys, smaller LCD font, or both, or perhaps dump the 20 pixel status line above and shift the keyboard down a bit. To please all, it should be user selectable. At least the toggle is quick and natural, so if you need the top row keys you swipe up and your thumb is already where it needs to be. A few minutes retraining my brain and I'll be set.
  5. Left swipe the LCD to get to printer, however printer does not have a right swipe to return (gotta press a button). Feature request.
  6. How about 5 line mode? Include L. Feature request.
  7. Key click as annoying as ever (and too loud). Fortunately it is optional. Any chance for an option to use the default key click sound? And or have an option to adjust the volume of the key click? Again spoiled by i41CX+.
  8. Feature request. Printer output save.
  9. Still open source. You have the power to change it yourself. That is, if you have OS/X and $99.

As just a 42S+printer replacement its perfect without all the extras. However the import/export is what makes this a 42S+. I still give it 5 of 5 stars.

Thanks!

Edited: 15 June 2009, 6:29 p.m.


#41

I just noticed that you can scroll the stack and program listing using the right side of the LCD. Very nice, its just like the thumb wheel feature I've always wanted. In stack mode it is the same as rolling up/down. In program mode its faster than the arrows. BTW 5 line program mode is very nice. 5 line stack with L should be easy.

Edited: 15 June 2009, 8:12 p.m.


#42

Quote:
I just noticed that you can scroll the stack and program listing using the right side of the LCD

This was kind of a last minute thing and maybe I should have waited for another release before putting it in so it would be more robust.. but what the hell.

It's currently implemented by issuing up/down key presses. Of course this breaks when the menu is up, needs fixin. I want to implement the cool little iPhone watermark scrollbar on the right so you can tell where in the program you are. I would also like to implement momentum similiar to standard iPhone scrolling, and suggested by Thomas. Finally, I don't like how it rolls over at the begin or end. I think this method works when using key presses, but when scrolling it's confusion, and also counter to familiar iPhone scroll behavior.


#43

Quote:
Finally, I don't like how it rolls over at the begin or end.

I do. Getting from the bottom to the top of a long program is only a flick away. Perhaps it can be optional.

For the stack, well it should roll, right?

Thanks again.


#44

Quote:
I do. Getting from the bottom to the top of a long program is only a flick away. Perhaps it can be optional. For the stack, well it should roll, right?

Yea, the stack behavior will stay the same.

With momentum it will be faster to move through the program, so getting to the beginning and end should pretty easy, and there is always the key up/down to move back to the top and bottom. None of this stuff is set in stone however.

#45

As an iPod touch user, WiFi is all I have and I rather like the web-based interface. A lot simpler to use than the reverse arrangement with i41cx+, that requires me to run my Mac as a webserver to move my program files onto to i41cx+, with still no way to get them off in a format usable in, say, V41 or Free42. Antonio has the nifty email feature but the files are importable only by other i41cx+ users. the 42s interface really is two-way--import files from desktop via web server upload, download by clicking on links in web interface and saving the files, which are good old fashioned raw files that can be used in Free42 or even V41 (and i41cx+) if one adheres to just 41C commands.

I like it. Tomayto tomahto.

I agree with your other comments, but as I have a first gen. iPod touch the key click issue is only relevant with headphones, and to my ears i quite faint compared with the sounds out of i41cx+.

As I have mentioned elsewhere, Byron has improved the speed, but the "R/S sometimes won't stop running program" bug comes up in pathological and unrealistic situations (e.g. LBL 00 BEEP GTO 00). This bothers me not one fig. In normal programs that converge to a result, the simulator is so fast that the R/S bug is irrelevant. Fair trade off.

Now if we only had a decent RPN calc for Blackberry. I have something called 10C, but it is limited in features, hard to use, and relatively expensive!

Les


#46

Quote:
as I have a first gen. iPod touch the key click issue is only relevant with headphones

Note that the next release will have the "standard" key click, which also works on the 1st generation iPod touch without headphones. It also has TONE and BEEP implementations that are truer to the original.


Once I have finished printer emulation in my own iPhone port, I will also help Byron with print spooling (capturing printer output in text and GIF files) -- I expect both versions will be virtually identical as far as printing is concerned.


The curious who have the iPhone SDK set up with an ad hoc development certificate can run the latest and greatest code from http://free42iphone.googlecode.com/.

- Thomas


#47

Quote:
The curious who have the iPhone SDK set up with an ad hoc development certificate can run the latest and greatest code from http://free42iphone.googlecode.com/.

Very nice. I did not know that both versions were in the same SVN repo. I just built your version. Nice. Thanks.
#48

Quote:
As an iPod touch user, WiFi is all I have and I rather like the web-based interface. A lot simpler to use than the reverse arrangement with i41cx+, that requires me to run my Mac as a webserver to move my program files onto to i41cx+, with still no way to get them off in a format usable in, say, V41 or Free42. Antonio has the nifty email feature but the files are importable only by other i41cx+ users. the 42s interface really is two-way--import files from desktop via web server upload, download by clicking on links in web interface and saving the files, which are good old fashioned raw files that can be used in Free42 or even V41 (and i41cx+) if one adheres to just 41C commands.

Actually, I'd like both. As an OS/X/Linux/UNIX user I am accustom to building, installing, and testing 41/42 code with "make" from the command line. And, given that I have a full time web site, "make test; make install" works great for me and makes it easy for me to share 41CX code with others. Of course, those of us with OS/X, Linux, or Cygwin can simply type:
python -m SimpleHTTPServer
and have instant private access to all of our 41CX programs for i41CX+ browsing.

Sharing 42S code requires that the user download to a PC and then upload via HTTP to Free42iPhone. Not really an issue if the user knows how to network both PC and iPhone. Like you said:

Quote:
Tomayto tomahto.

Something that I started working on that I will not have ready for sometime is an i41CX+ app store. Basically you visit the site, pick your 41CX app from mobile Safari and it automatically launches and loads into i41CX+. Here is a quick and dirty example to demonstrate how it works: http://sense.net/~egan/41cx/chars.html.

A 42S version of this would be nice too don't you think?


#49

Quote:
Something that I started working on that I will not have ready for sometime is an i41CX+ app store. Basically you visit the site, pick your 41CX app from mobile Safari and it automatically launches and loads into i41CX+. Here is a quick and dirty example to demonstrate how it works: http://sense.net/~egan/41cx/chars.html.

Whoa! You can install your own protocol in Safari on the iPhone, and have it be handled by an external app? I had no idea.


Now I'll have to find out how to do that. :-)


#50

Quote:
Whoa! You can install your own protocol in Safari on the iPhone, and have it be handled by an external app? I had no idea.

I just looked into this, and it doesn't appear that you can, unless I'm missing something.

However, what you can do is run UIWebView in application, and you can install handlers for hyperlinks, Which is probably the implementation that Egan is referring to.

I really like Egan's suggestion, and I was thinking about something like this in general terms some months ago, but this focuses on a reasonable implementation path. Bonus, this would provide a nice way to associate documentation with programs for in-calc reference. This would be nothing more complicated then a quick reference page for the program.

#51

Egan, I have to admit that is way cool, the the web-based "store" idea with programs loadable using the customized i41cx// protocol.

On reflection, I have to admit I would love both in Free42 and iPhone42s--Byron's & Thomas' implementation where the handheld is the server, and Antonio's where the desktop or website is.

But let's face it, even with their limitations, Byron, Thomas, and Antonio (and Eric and others before them) have given us wonderful and useful little programs cheaply. I was one of the lucky ones who jumped onto i41cx+ at half the present price. And I have read some criticisms in the US App Store that 42S is too expensive at five bucks. C'mon! Some of us around here have spent a small fortune collecting the actual calculators!

Les


#52

Quote:
I have read some criticisms in the US App Store that 42S is too expensive at five bucks.

There's just no pleasing some people. Judging by the reviews for the various Voyager emulators and simulators in the iTunes App Store, if the price for 42S/iPhone would have been $20 or more, there would have been no complaints whatsoever. Or maybe it's just that the Voyager fans are more fanatical than the Pioneer fans. :-D

But seriously -- I read a lot of on-line news, and I see complaints about open-source software on a daily basis; I'll bet you anything that the people who complain the loudest are exactly those who *enjoy* the benefits of free software while never (yet) having actually *created*, never mind *supported* any -- where "supported" means "donated dozens of hours of work or more" or "hundreds of dollars or more".

They, too, will grow up eventually. :-)


#53

Thomas, I think I donated a measly thirty bucks to Free42 a couple of years ago and you advised me that that was generous as open source freeware users are not terribly munificent. I was mortified to hear that. Over the years, your extensive personal attention to my interest in Free42 has certainly given me my money's worth :)

Edited: 18 June 2009, 1:11 p.m.


#54

Well, my top priority was and is to make sure that there will always be an HP-42S simulator available to everyone who needs or wants one, without having to rely on proprietary stuff which may be abandoned and then end up in software limbo -- hence my use of the GPL.


I would *also* like to make a ton of money from Free42, but those two goals are not compatible, because of the GPL.


I'm not complaining, though; Free42 has paid for a couple of vacations already and sales for the iPhone look like they'll pay for a third (I mean, for the Mac I had to buy to be able to do iPhone development in the first place!). Given that money wasn't my incentive for writing it in the first place, every penny I receive is a bonus. :-)

#55

Hi Egan, Thanks for your feedback and your five stars!. The best place from a development standpoint for enhancement suggestions and bugs is at:

http://code.google.com/p/free42iphone/issues/list

about PRLCD in 4 line mode, yea... there are probably several cases like this that 4 lines doesn't handle yet. In fact it was Thomas that fixed the original PRLCD issue. On the other hand, there are a few cases that it kind of falls out nicely, for example "SHOW" which operates unaware of 4 line mode, result in a nice effect such that it displays above the X and Y stack lines.

Quote:
Import/export requires a WiFi connection so that it can act as an HTTP server. Given how spoiled I have been with i41CX+, this level of import/export is very minimal, however better than nothing.

Better than nothing? :) I would agree with you there, I would add it is even better than something. I think the web server solution is consistent across platforms, a minimal amount of fuss for most use cases, and familiar/intuitive, in my subjective point of view. I even like this solution more then placing files in a directory system somewhere, say for example if the iPhone allowed you to network file browse, it's harder to get wrong this way.

Kudos to Thomas Okken for writing the Free42 web server that provides this functionality. It is actually more capable then demonstrated in 42s in that it will actually upload and download files and store them on the local directory system, and also navigate a filesystem. This functionality is not exposed at the moment. Initial implementations of it allowed you to browse the entire iPhone directory system from root down and download files.

Anyway, I think this whole scheme will pay dividends in future releases by providing a consistent general purpose way for moving data files around.


#56

Quote:
http://code.google.com/p/free42iphone/issues/list

Thanks. I'll follow up there.
Quote:
I think the web server solution is consistent across platforms, a minimal amount of fuss for most use cases, and familiar/intuitive, in my subjective point of view. I even like this solution more then placing files in a directory system somewhere, say for example if the iPhone allowed you to network file browse, it's harder to get wrong this way.

True. Eventually I'd like the option for both. But its not critical, just a nice to have. If you get 42S://post?... working like the aformentioned i41CX+ example, then that would actually be better for supplying apps to unteathered (WiFi to PC) iPhones.
Quote:
Kudos to Thomas Okken for writing the Free42 web server that provides this functionality. It is actually more capable then demonstrated in 42s in that it will actually upload and download files and store them on the local directory system, and also navigate a filesystem. This functionality is not exposed at the moment. Initial implementations of it allowed you to browse the entire iPhone directory system from root down and download files.

Look forward to the updates.

Thanks again.

#57

no upgrade yet appeared in the UK store ?

Nigel


#58

I just switched my default store to the UK one and version 2 is indeed there, for 2.99 pounds.

Les


#59

Les, I've got 42s installed on my iPod touch but can't determine which version. Any hints?

Regards,

John


#60

Shift-OPTIONS. If you have a button labels "Import/Export Programs", you have version 2. If not, you still have version 1.

#61

John, this is one thing that is missing from 42s that Thomas has always had in Free42--access to "About" information that can confirm the version. As it stands now, the only way you know you have v. 1 or v. 2 is taking note of the slightly improved skin graphics, the much better speed, and the the extra functionality. Both i41cx+ and the Free42 build from source code I am playing with have version info very clearly available somewhere. This could be another request to Mr. Foster via Google Code.


#62

You're right, it's kinda silly there is no way to know what version of the application you are using. I'll fix that.


#63

When pressing "shift modes", the 4th soft menu button is blank. Could that be a hidden version button?

#64

Perhaps the issue is that I don't have the latest 2.2 Itouch software installed (let alone version 3).

However the 42s version 2 post date on the UK store is Jan 2009 not June 2009 and I purchased Byron's app in Feb/March of this year.

So I remain a little confused.

Nigel

Edited: 18 June 2009, 4:00 a.m.


#65

You should be able to get 42S version 2.0 even with an older version of the OS; it does not require 3.0. (The next release probably will, though.)

#66

The App Store is not consistent with this. In some listings the post date reflects the date of the most recent release. In others, as in this case, the post date is that of the original v. 1 release to the App Store. What gives this away as the most recent release is that it is declared as v. 2, and in the right side bar you can read "What's new in this release" to see the various enhancements.

If you are having trouble with this showing up as an automatic upgrade in your Applications panel in iTunes, you may, as I did, have to manually remove 42s from the iPod, re-download 42s from the App Store (it will, eventually, tell you that this is free, so when it asks "would you like to purchase?" it is safe to say yes), and on resyncing the new version is written over to the iPod. Alas, this loses any existing data in 42s v. 1, so maybe you should try to sync first and see if that overwrites with the new version before removing the old version manually. I had to remove my old version manually since it was a build of the source code and as far as iTunes was concerned I was already updated! However, for completeness, I wanted the official App Store version, though I am sure Mr. Foster would indicate there was no difference.

Bottom line is this: you are seeing the newest version in the UK store and you can download for free. The Jan 2009 date is a bit misleading.

Les


#67

I will be updating my Itouch with version 3.0 software tonight and will then see if the new version 2.0 shows as an update.

If not I will remove and re install.

Thanks for your suggestion. I will also post a review on the UK store as there doesn't appear to be any reviews as yet there.

Nigel


#68

Thanks for the feedback Les.

With version 1 of 42s installed on my iPod Touch I noticed that version 2 wasn't showing up as update. I went ahead and updated my iPod Touch OS to version 2.2.1. 42s version 2 still wouldn't show up as an update so I went ahead and paid another $5 for version 2. I don't know if I was supposed to pay for the update but software such as 42s is worth it.

Thanks Byron and Thomas.


John


#69

Quote:
I went ahead and paid another $5 for version 2. I don't know if I was supposed to pay for the update but software such as 42s is worth it.

Uhg, I'm sorry you had to pay for it twice, you shouldn't have to do that. I don't know what the deal is with the updates. Maybe this stuff rolls out slowly, or it's just simply bugged!

From the developer portal point of view, where versions are submitted, I don't see version 1.0 anymore (it was removed as soon as 2.0 passed review). Strange that version 1.0 is still "floating" around.

#70

That's a glitch.

Write iTunes customer support and get your extra five bucks back. They were very good with me when I double-download a CD due to my own error. So if this not your error they should be even more flexible. You have proof in the system of owning the software and updates are supposed to be free.

Les

#71

I wonder if the failure to update the release date is the issue. Maybe iTunes uses this, and not just the version number, to discern that an update is due.

I think the release date is supposed to be corrected. Look at the page for i41cx+ 2.2. Says June 15th, 2009, like it should. Have never missed an update of that software.

Updating should not be such a hassle! Typically, it isn't.

Hope you get your fiver back.

Les

#72

Went to Version 3.0 (Apple Software). No update showing.Deleted 42s and then reinstalled.

Nigel


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