Valentin - Still interested in HP 33s Emulator?



#2

A few months (years?) ago Valentin offered to translate some of his programs to work with the HP 33s if someone could provide him with an emulator. As some of you may recall that went nowhere fast. I was always surprised at all the comments against having Valentin translate his programs. Regardless, I know that Valentain now has an HP 35S, so the HP 33s may pose no interest to him.

Nonetheless, a few months ago I was able to get an emulator from HP, as a chemistry instructor. I get permission to install it on three computers, I have used it for my laptop and desktop.

Thus, Valentin, if you are still interested, let me know and I will forward to you the program so you can play with it or do what you wish with it.

Osvaldo


#3

Quote:
I get permission to install it on three computers, I have used it for my laptop and desktop.

Thus, Valentin, if you are still interested, let me know and I will forward to you the program so you can play with it or do what you wish with it.


That's a generous offer, but are you sure that the permission HP granted extends to installing it on a computer belonging to a third party?

Based on statements made by HP employees at past HHC conferences, I expect that if Valentin asked HP for the emulator, they would likely make it available to him.


#4

I don't know if I'd go THAT far. For some reason, HP seems VERY protective of their educational emulators program. I know people who are truly educators who have been turned down. Those of us on the fringe don't even get the courtesy of a reply.

I agree, however, about watching the usage clauses.

thanks,
bruce


#5

Why they not want people to have emulator? With advent of 35s, it seem to me that 33s on the way out, and production more than likely has stopped already. I sure they just trying to flush distribution channels at this point.

#6

Eric:

I will point you to the original thread about 2 years ago

http://www.hpmuseum.org/cgi-sys/cgiwrap/hpmuseum/archv015.cgi?read=80196

[pre]
Towards the bottom you will see Valentin's response to a similar answer to yours. The great Valentin wrote:

"Thanks a lot for your kind, supportive words but I don't think anybody at HP gives a damn about what I may or may not do in this forum or elsewhere, and if someone actually does, I doubt they can pull the necessary strings to accomplish even such a minor feat as letting me have an HP33 simulator."

Now I do not want to get anyone in trouble or do I want to repeat the type of discussion on that original thread, which became very heated. However, I believe, that the HP community missed on a great opportunity to have Valentin port some amazing and exciting programs to the 33s. I know that he is probably enjoying the 35s too much to have a desire to play with the 33s, but I just thought of offering.

The following link has the terms of use:

http://www.hp.com/calculators/emulators/otheremulator.html?jumpid=reg_R1002_USEN

Now, I may be picking, however, in terms of use, it seems to me that only students are not allowed to use the software. Receiving the software by cd is restricted to educators. HP sent me the software by download link. I'll let you draw your own conclusions. If illegal, oh well, I won't do it. Nonetheless, as mentioned before, this may all be a moot point, since the interest may not be there anymore.

Osvaldo


#7

If it is the 33s emulator that appears on the screen as a life sized image of the 33s calculator, I have it on my work computer and students have seen it there and have watched me use it, especially when I'm too lazy to reach into my briefcase for the real 33s.

It seems, alas, none of them were too interested at all, except in the results, and how it compared to theirs.

I suspect they won't care at all that the emulator is RPN.

Someone here posted just a few days ago maybe that HP should give away RPN calculators, or even their algebraic ones to students, especially high school ones, to cultivate a greater appreciation of RPN machines, or at least, any HP calculator product. Letting them at the emulator software might even have a similar effect. But as of right now, the kids wouldn't even care to steal it. Not flattering at all.

McAfee did this a long time ago, giving out free versions of their anti-virus engine and updating it every week or so. They had me hooked until recently, when they made accessing their site and getting support so difficult.

HP, at least, has continued their rather good support and I think that if they were willing to so invest, they might reap many customers in years to come.


#8

You know, the lack of a 33s emulator MIGHT be because HP knew the 35s was coming out in a year or so (surely they have at least that long a lead time on building something like that). I mean, if *I* were in HP's shoes, knowing that something truly better was coming out in a year or so to "replace" (my finger quotes...) the 33s, I certainly wouldn't expend any energy on building something like that. I'd focus on building something for the 35s instead.

That's my guess, anyhow.

thanks,
bruce


#9

The problem is not that there is not 33s emulator the problem is the availability of the emulator. Hp has emulators for the 10BII, 12c, 17BII+, 39G+, 48GII. 49G+, and the 33s. However, they only make them available to educators. I had to provide a copy of the syllabus that I use for my students and in the syllabus I had to require or recommend the use of the model that I was requesting. In addition you can only request one emulator regardless of the classes or types of classes that you teach. For my students I recommend the hp 33s if money is tight, however, I recomment the 48GII or hte 49G+ if they can afford it. Nonetheless, when requesting the emulator I had to choose and I chose the 33s. I must say that it works just like the calculator and it is fun to use.

Osvaldo

#10

Quote:
If illegal, oh well, I won't do it.

I wasn't saying that it was illegal, and I'm sure you weren't intending to offer anything that wasn't strictly above-board. I was just concerned that it *might* be a violation of an EULA, and that if it was, you might not be aware of it. Not having seen the EULA, I have no idea whether the proposal would violate the EULA terms or not.

#11

Hi, Osvaldo:

Osvaldo wrote:

    "[...] if you are still interested, let me know and I will forward to you the program so you can play with it or do what you wish with it."

      Thank you very much for your extremely kind offer and further your kind appreciation but, regrettably, once my vacations are over I find myself with a severe lack of free time and so I have to correctly arrange my priorities.

      At the time I posted the original request for an HP33S emulator, that was the one and only easily-available RPN calc, and further it was one of the approved models for NCEES exams, so it found a market and generated quite a lot of interest among the HP calc-fan community.

      Thus, though I profoundly disliked its physical incarnation (not the programming model, mind you), I saw it as a service to the community to port some of my best unpublished (or published) technical or mathematical programs written at their time for such machines as the HP-34C, HP-67, etc, which would perfectly run in the new HP33S within its maximum data register constraints, and would provide a base foundation of useful software. I didn't want the physical machine at all (even to the point of rejecting it as a gift) so an emulator was the way to go.

      Much to my surprise, my request went finally unfulfilled and that was the end of it. Now the new HP35s is available, and it absolutely supersedes the HP33S in most every aspect, while being highly upward-compatible with it, so the HP33S is rendered utterly obsolete and I can see many owners getting rid of them for whatever they can get in order to buy the HP35S as soon as they can.

      This being so, it surely would be a waste of time and effort to try and port old programs to an already obsolete, superseded model when there's even more scarcity of basic materials for the newer model. So I'm redirecting all my present efforts to the HP35s which means three brand-new programs (with corresponding articles) will appear in the next issue of Datafile.

      Converting old programs isn't as good an idea now, as RAM restrictions have been mostly removed and so it's better to simply write new programs to take advantage of the fact instead of porting old programs created around the 26-register limitation which had to jump through all kinds of hoops merely in order to cope with it, thus resulting in tricky, convoluted, slow-running code. This was unavoidable in the case of the HP33S, but the new HP35s gets that drudgery wholly out of the picture.

      Anyway, thanks again for your kind offer and

Best regards from V.

Edited: 21 Aug 2007, 6:45 a.m.


#12

Valentin:

I figured as much, as the saying goes a dollar short and a day late. Anyways I look forward to your publications on the 35s, and your challenges are always, well a "challenge". I'll finish by saying that it would have been quite a sight to see a 7 x 7 matrix handled on the 33s.

Ed:

My students are the same way, only interested in the final answer and many times without paying attention to the actual process. Several months ago there were several threads on how TI calculators were dummy proof, that you did not need to pay much attention into how the problem is entered. I never answered in that post even though I wanted to share some opinions. However, I have had students that regardeless of how "dummy proof" the calculator is they always find a way to key in the process wrong. Somehow it becomes a challenge for some students to use the exponent key instead they type x 10 ^. In many stoichimetric problems it ends up messing up the sequence. This is a problem every semester, and even after I tell them repeatedly to use the exponent key, half way through the semester there are always a handful of students still getting wrong answers for not using the proper input keys.

Osvaldo Rodriguez

Edited: 21 Aug 2007, 12:56 p.m.


#13

Quote:
... Somehow it becomes a challenge for some students to use the exponent key instead they type x 10 ^...

This one is especially troubling, that they can't figure this out just by looking at the keyboard... of ANY calculator!

Quote:
... In many stoichimetric problems it ends up messing up the sequence...

... Osvaldo Rodriguez


It will mess up any problem. It doesn't get better when they somehow trudge forward up to equilibrium problems. By then, it's clear it's not the calculator!

However, I still believe that even today's better student can benefit (greatly) from using instead (HP's or any) RPN calculator; it just seems to stimulate more thinking and realization on the part of the user.


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