HP35s - This how it should have looked - modified arrow keys.



#31

The classic look HP35s.

I modified the proposed design of the HP35s to show how it could have been made to look even more "classic":-


http://www.flickr.com/photos/8771575@N08/531755750/


If someone with access rights wants to upload this picture directly into this thread for visual convenience, feel free to do so.

Cheers
Jason


#32

You can do that yourself, Jason. Just hit the button marked "Link" in the editor, and fill in the URL and what you would like the text to say. The code to do what you want is then included at the bottom of your posting.

Here's your link done up that way.

The code for that is:

[link:http://www.flickr.com/photos/8771575@N08/531755750/]Here's your link done up that way.[/link] 

Regards,
Howard


#33

Awesome work, it is much better now IMHO. Congratulations.

#34

We are focusing to much on the keyboard, hey - there is also a back side of this neat little thing waiting to be filled with information.

When talking classic design features like a chrome border and the like, why not adding the good old back side labels!

Rear label - HP35 - german

Look at these arrows! Gives the whole thing a kind of ENIGMA touch. Imagine the next time a friend wants to borrow a calculator and you give him/her your brandnew HP-35s. When he/she is still wondering what the he.. this big ENTER key is good for and where the = key got lost, you simply say: "there is a short-manual on the back side." This finally will put him/her over the edge!

#35

Hi Jason,

Forgive me, but I'm just not seeing the logic in your improved arrow keys. Both of the arrows point up. It seems to me the yellow shift key should have an arrow that points straight up (indicating the above key function), and the blue shift key's arrow should point straight down (for the bottom side of the key function), with no left of right bends in the arrows at all. Somthing akin to the arrows on the up and down cursor keys would be perfect IMHO.
Are you sure you posted the right picture?

Best regards, Hal


#36

Hal,

Jason was talking about the cursor keys. The prefixes you mentioned have been addressed here.

#37

I modified my previous image to remove the arrows from the blue and gold shift keys - is now similar to the HP42 :-


http://www.flickr.com/photos/8771575@N08/532162815/


Another option is to add "f" and "g" to the blue and gold shift keys similar to the HP25 :-


http://www.flickr.com/photos/8771575@N08/532162821/


Cheers
Jason


#38

I have no problem with the cursor or shift keys, I am disapointed by the lack of a STO key, giving precedence to less used keys. I don't understand this at all. Love your imagined layouts, Sam


#39

I agree with the STO key as a primary. It is much more important than x^2 for instance, I think. Of course RCL is even more important in my opinion.


Decisions on keys are never easy. Look at the transition from 11c to 32sii:

GTO moved to shifted,

clearing x, regs or sigma moved to shift and a menu so one extra step,

10^x went to shifted, but an improvement (to me) was moving LN to primary,

SST was moved to shifted,

One reason for these changes was that the 32sii actually had two fewer keys--37 instead of 39! It also has more functions, but the menues pretty much make up for that--and the change in HYP handling--only one HYP key rather than a Hyp^-1 key as the 11c had. Perhaps this was part of the original Pioneer design concept of a simplified clean keyboard with menus (32s, 42s, 22s? 17b).

#40

Quote:
I am disapointed by the lack of a STO key, giving precedence to less used keys. I don't understand this at all.

STO need be used only once for a given value, while RCL can be used many times. Hence, RCL is unshifted on the conceptual HP-33s. I also prefer STO unshifted, but the aren't very many free keys.

Naturally, the reverse of this arrangement is found on the HP-28/48/49...

-- KS


Edited: 7 June 2007, 12:03 a.m.

#41

The one with "f" and "g" is your best one yet, and much better than HP's version. I'd buy one of these tomorrow if they were available.


#42

C'mon Wayne. IT still doesn't look like a wedge of sharp metal!


#43

Edited: 6 June 2007, 4:02 a.m. after one or more responses were posted


#44

:-)) Thanks, Howard, I love this one! Though it reminds me of the 33s - it should be all black.

#45

This Message was deleted. This empty message preserves the threading when a post with followup(s) is deleted. If all followups have been removed, the original poster may delete this post again to make this placeholder disappear.


#46

OK, I changed the title back.

Regards,
Howard

#47

Hey, that's very close! BIG :-)

Gene

#48

No, this is what I want (but not as a calculator).

#49

You must have a reading comprehension problem. I've said several times that I prefer certain things, but there's a difference between what I prefer and what I'll accept. Jason's latest version is completely acceptable.

You really haven't been paying attention if you think I want a "wedge" of anything. I prefer perfectly straight lines and perfect right angles, which means a rectangular solid, not a wedge. Also, I don't want metal, but something with the look and feel and weight of marble. Plastic would do (if the internal components are sufficiently heavy), but a black ceramic material would be even better.

But, as I said, I'd buy Jason's design right away if HP had the sense to build it.

#50

Hi Jason,

prefix-wise, I like your keyboard with the pure colors best. To write about shift keys in manuals and wherever else is easier with f and g. And they are looking good, too.

More generally speaking, I've no problem with the cursors HP has shown. I see them as a tribute to modern times. And they are more ergonomic than the patterns you offer.

What hurts me (and others) more is the shifted STO, the dislocation of x<>y, the waste of space for <-ENG/ENG-> and the like. My attempt to get this solved is found and explained in this previous post (BTW: another example of an automated link). I would adopt your f and g if you allow.


#51

Quote:
More generally speaking, I've no problem with the cursors HP has shown. I see them as a tribute to modern times.

And that is precisely what I dislike about them most. I want something that's more a tribute to this and this, or at least this.


#52

Oh yes, I remember the ones of your last picture very well: I learned computing on them and later developped a "fast" data acquisition system on a pdp 11 with 64kB and a total of 5MB disk space, using a 1600bpi MagTape. I'll look how I can approach your needs, though I'll probably be unable to fulfill them completely.

#53

Hi,

I'd prefer the cursor keys to be arranged like in the HP-48.

So the MODE key would go the the top right,

the left-arrow key would go one pos left,

the downarrow key would go where the left-arrow key was,

and the i key would go up one row, where the MODE key was.

The GTO key could be shifted, to make room for an unshifted STO key.

Regards

Raymond

#54

I am missing something.. What benefit do you gain? You don't gain any more keys and you lose the natural directional nature in the proposed HP design. Why would you not position arrow keys as HP did? The 48 series and 28C/S series did not offer an optimal keypad layout wrt the arrows.


#55

Quote:
What benefit do you gain?

In my case, the benefit would be not having to use the calculator with my eyes closed, or trying to shield it to keep people around me from seeing me use it.


#56

I still do not understand. Why would you not want the arrow cursors arranged in a rational manner as opposed to the 48 / 28 scenario (I don't think the original posters arrangement is as bad as the 48 / 28 series but I don't see it being optimal..) Why would you need to shield your calculator from view?


#57

Quote:
Why would you not want the arrow cursors arranged in a rational manner as opposed to the 48 / 28 scenario...

I think the "48 / 28 scenario" is rational and also looks much better. The diamond-pattern keys seriously offend my aesthetic sensibilities; they make the calculator look like a trivial bit of "consumer electronics" (like a game or a TV remote or a cell phone) rather than a serious scientific instrument.

Quote:
Why would you need to shield your calculator from view?

I'd be embarrassed to let anyone see me using it -- just as much as if it were pink and covered with fluffy bunnies and kittens. (Maybe I shouldn't be giving HP any ideas. :-(


#58

Quote:
I'd be embarrassed to let anyone see me using it -- just as much as if it were pink and covered with fluffy bunnies and kittens. (Maybe I shouldn't be giving HP any ideas. :-(

I hope you realize that the negative associations you have with certain arrangements of keys are subjective, that is, they're in your head.

#59

Quote:
I hope you realize that the negative associations you have with certain arrangements of keys are subjective, that is, they're in your head.

OK, look at it this way: Which cursor-key style do you think looks more modern, up-to-date, in keeping with current styles? And which do you think looks "old" (or at least, "old-fashioned")?

Which would a teenager or twenty-something be more likely to consider "cool" and "in style?" Well, that's the one I don't want. Something the average person considers "modern" or "trendy" or "in style" is what I would consider a "negative association."

#60

Hi,

the HP-48 and the HP-28 have a total different cursor key arrangement.

The layout on the HP-48 (Upside-down T) is very common,

nearly every PC keyboard uses this layout,

whereas the cursor key arrangement on the 28C/S is not very good IMHO.

The arrangement and implementation as seen on the unmodified 35s pictures

isn't bad in itself, but the cursor keys shape doesn't fit very well

compared to the other keys. The cursor keys look cheap IMO.

Raymond


Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  HP35s Program Four Slings Lift Calculation Jean-Marc Biram (Australia) 2 817 12-16-2013, 07:21 PM
Last Post: Jean-Marc Biram (Australia)
  HP35s Calculator Max Rope Tension Program Jean-Marc Biram (Australia) 10 1,589 12-12-2013, 12:03 AM
Last Post: Jean-Marc Biram (Australia)
  Trouble entering a HP35s program line Arno 2 557 04-05-2013, 06:28 PM
Last Post: Arno
  HP35s scientific calculator GREG W THOMAS 4 706 03-22-2013, 06:49 AM
Last Post: Thomas Radtke
  Very fast modified TEA for HP 48 and up! Raymond Del Tondo 0 310 11-23-2012, 08:43 PM
Last Post: Raymond Del Tondo
  HP35s "MEMORY CLEAR" flashes Mark Paris 1 459 08-31-2012, 07:35 PM
Last Post: Bart (UK)
  HP35S keyboard Nick R 8 911 08-01-2012, 01:27 PM
Last Post: Dave Shaffer (Arizona)
  HP71 Modified John W Kercheval 0 251 05-19-2012, 06:01 PM
Last Post: John W Kercheval
  Where should I post new HP35s bugs Andres Capdevila 33 2,772 03-13-2012, 01:00 PM
Last Post: Jeff O.
  HP35s Internal Investigations - new processor? stefan 5 789 03-08-2012, 04:48 AM
Last Post: Paul Dale

Forum Jump: