HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Printable Version +- HP Forums (https://archived.hpcalc.org/museumforum) +-- Forum: HP Museum Forums (https://archived.hpcalc.org/museumforum/forum-1.html) +--- Forum: Old HP Forum Archives (https://archived.hpcalc.org/museumforum/forum-2.html) +--- Thread: HP41cv expiriences of a new user (/thread-238860.html) |
HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Wolfgang - 02-09-2013 Hi, It is a long post and if it is OK with the forum members I will split it into parts over the next couple of days.
Just for my background:
Back to the 41 .
My 48sx has aged and has quite a lot of bad pixels, so I got some years ago a HP50g. I never got really used to it. I always compared it to my 48sx and saw the short comings. But first things first. Here my absolute number one priority for calculators: Programming !
Now programming the HP41 is different to the HP48. It was like I have not done anything else before, probably my TI59 was kicking in. (I do own a TI59, so heads up, TI59 vs HP41 is for a later post. Do not expect any ranting,I do like the TI59 but I love RPN)
I have to discover the capabilities of the HP41, that will take a few days or weeks. So after the first evening with the HP41 I am happy and eager to move on.
Please, if this is the wrong place to post my excitements , let me know.
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Walter B - 02-09-2013 Hallo Wolfgang, This is the perfectly right place to post your excitements. Enjoy!
d:-)
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Eddie W. Shore - 02-09-2013 Concur - post all excitement here!
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Massimo Gnerucci (Italy) - 02-09-2013 Welcome to the club! Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - aurelio - 02-09-2013 Compliments for the purchase, have fun!
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Thomas Klemm - 02-09-2013 Two links that might be useful:
Cheers Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Jake Schwartz - 02-09-2013 Hi, ....some day when a search for popular program modules begins, don't forget to check out the PPC ROM, containing 8K and 128 or so of the favorite programs and routines from the user community when it was created in 1980-81.
Jake
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - David Hayden - 02-10-2013 Hi Wolfgang! I look forward to your posts. My experience was the opposite of yours: I've owned an HP-41CV since the early 1980's and bought a 50g about 4 years ago, knowing absolutely nothing about RPL.
Dave
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user [ The Wand] - Wolfgang - 02-10-2013 Thanks for your encouraging comments.
I was not sure of what to think about a barcode reader. In fact I discovered that it might be the most useful tool I got in the package.
There is this nice online tool where you can copy paste your program and generate barcode . With the wand it is very easy (if you master the special way to hold it) to scan in this program. Absolute impressive !
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user [The Printer] - Wolfgang - 02-10-2013 Third part of my discovery report :-)) As a true engineer I reject to read manuals, what can they tell me what I do not already know ?
So I powered the printer and plugged it into the HP41.
So I looked closer at the printer, found the battery bay , opened it and the battery fell right in my hands.
Pressing the "Print Button" made the print head doing something but the paper did not advance.
I went online to search for a solution .... and found it. OMG !
Well I rigged up a battery pack with AA rechargeable batteries .
I think I read a while back a report of a HP user comparing the 82143A Printer with the TI 100A printer cradle for the TI59. I already warned that I would do some TI vs HP comparison, so here it comes.
1) The TI printer has a better build quality from the look and feel
2) It is hard to get the right paper width for the TI printer. For some reason TI's original paper is wider than the nowadays available thermos paper. Not too much of an annoyance as long as you do not need the whole width the printer is capable of.
3) both printer have graphic and alpha numeric capabilities. The HP has clearly the edge on the easiness of handling. With the TI printer getting alpha numeric on the printer is a Op-code orgy. 4) A little nite picking now: My fat fingers have some trouble to fiddle the paper into the HP printer, works much better for me on the TI printer. 5) The battery power of the HP makes it nice and mobile. The TI printer does not have this option at all 6) I like the TI system of a printer cradle much more than the cable spaghetti of the HP. HP did a much nicer job with the IR printer for my HP48sx but still the cradle is in my view the best way to operate. Desktop to handheld on the fly, just perfect.
And last but not least, I do use this just for a few hours, so I may have not discovered some of it's nicer features. So please advise me.
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Wolfgang - 02-10-2013 Thomas, Jake,
thanks for your suggestions.
I hope I can get the HP41 mastered to the extend that I can have the formulas solved like on the HP48sx and have too the alphanumeric input.
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Mike Morrow - 02-10-2013 Quote: Welcome! But please be fair to the TI-59 when you compare it to the HP-41C series. The TI-59 appeared in early 1977, a few months after the HP-67. The TI-59 was accurately the contemporary competitor to the HP-67, not to the HP-41C that came out almost three years after the TI-59. The HP-41C was the first small calculator that had a real "operating system" in firmware to organize and control its functions. There was nothing like that before.
This is a good place for people with your interests in these devices.
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user [The Printer] - Massimo Gnerucci (Italy) - 02-10-2013
Quote:
I think you should: I have fond memories of me reading them in '79, they were a good reading, well worth the effort. Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Wolfgang - 02-10-2013 Mike,
It is just that I have the TI59 used for some time. The HP41 is for me a replacement for my HP48sx and I would not dare to compare them because they are two different animals. I am more on the search for the calculator (system) which fits my needs.
Who knows, maybe HP decides to get a pimped HP35s with USB port and full alphanumeric capabilities. That would pick my interest.
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user [ The Wand] - Thomas Klemm - 02-10-2013 Quote: The project nutstudio provides a utility to generate barcodes as well.
Quote: The PIL-Box comes to my mind.
Kind regards Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user [The Printer] - Garth Wilson - 02-10-2013 Yes, although modern manuals are terrible, the HP manuals of that day were wonderful. I would read through, and by the time I got to the end, I felt like I knew the product well, even though I never got to the "hard part" (because there wasn't any!)
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Walter B - 02-10-2013
Quote:AFAIK HP doesn't :-( But there's a user project started: search for 43S in this forum. It may become what you are looking for (but will take some months, presumably n x 10^1).
d:-)
Re: Manuals - Maximilian Hohmann - 02-10-2013 Quote:
That's so true! I remember reading the manual of my father's HP-67 cover to cover when he got that calculator. And later the manual of my own Ti-59. But those probably were the last two manuals I ever read as I went on to become an engineer too ;-) Edited: 10 Feb 2013, 4:30 p.m.
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Wolfgang - 02-11-2013 I discovered that there are ways to switch the processor board and of a HP41 and get a modern version with all the roms and a serial interface build in. Also a nice way to stay classic but have the modern world close by.
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Massimo Gnerucci (Italy) - 02-12-2013 Yep! You were quick at it: we had to wait for some 30 years for Monte's marvel... ;-)
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Siegfried (Austria) - 02-12-2013 Hi and thanks for sharing your experiences. I used a HP-15C "lent" from my dad during most of senior high school which got lost/stolen on my first job. Since then I've had a soft spot in my heart for HP calculators and during the last two years I have started to collect a few. I am now awaiting a HP-41CV (coveted but out of reach during my youth) with card reader and would like to ask the gurus if they could give some hints on what expansion modules to look for to make the calc "fully operational". Does one need the advantage/extended functions and/or time module(s) if one is more of a nostalgic tinkerer and less inclined to really use the calc for serious maths/work? (I will probably not try to buy further peripherals.)
Thanks for your thoughts!
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Walter B - 02-12-2013 Hallo Siegfried, IMHO the Advantage Module is a must - it lets your HP-41CV do what every HP-15C could do. Time Module depends on you wanting to use it as a timer.
d:-)
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Mike Morrow - 02-12-2013 When I sold my 1980 HP-41C to buy a HP-41CX in 1984, it of course came with the CV's memory, time module, extended functions module, and additional functions found only on the CX. Pretty impressive out of the box. I added a X-memory module, HP-41 Advantage module, thermal science module, and HP 82242A IR printer module. I considered my HP-41CX then to be pretty well populated for any day-to-day problem. I had a rarely used card reader and I carried the MATH/STAT and NAVIGATION modules in the excellent HP black leather case that I bought in 1977 for my HP-67. I still have it all...almost new condition, though the card reader rollers are gummed-up. It's a nostalgia trip to use...except for its expansion capability it is significantly inferior to the HP 42S in almost every particular...IMHO, of course. But there's never been a better calculator keyboard than that found on the HP-41C-series.
Frankly, I never liked the Advantage module. I preferred my HP-15C.
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Dan Grelinger - 02-13-2013 I will put in a good word for the 41CL. It is truly a marvel. It preserves practically all of the 'good' of the HP-41CX, and adds much to it, making it the perfect combination of 'new' and 'old'.
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Ángel Martin - 02-13-2013 No other calculator beats the CL - it really is the ultimate calculator - just my opinion of course. Am I biased? well sure, aren't we all?
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Massimo Gnerucci (Italy) - 02-13-2013 Quote:
´´´´´´´´´´´´´´´´´´´´´´¶¶¶¶¶¶¶¶¶
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Ron Ross - 02-13-2013 Ah..HA!!! A good word for the Hp 15c??? Getting sentamental??? I admit Mike, I nearly always like your posts and reviews (aside from your picking on the HP 15c and all voyager layouts). Other than your negative reviews of voyagers, your opinions and logic are spot on in my book. Your points on the voyagers are also noted, but I do like their layouts and use an Hp12c for a general 4 function calculator. I will take up one arguement with you about the new Hp15c LE. You have said it is worthless as a professional tool because of the PSE bug and the random bit count of the program byte count. That would certainly hold true if the Hp 15c LE were to be used as a serious computational device like the HP 15c of old was. However, how many serious Engineers would use their Hp15c like that? It is a simple number cruncher for sophisticated math and simple keystroke programmable ie simple 20-30 step programs. Do any more and you should be using a different tool in today's world. So, the Hp 15c LE served its intended audience unless that audience didn't evolve from T-Rexsouriouses. I don't argue the fact and certainly wished Hp had instead released an Hp42s (or better, an Hp42s+ with the addition of all the conversion features of the Hp48G, a usb plug, an SD card to transfer real programs and 32K to 1 Meg of RAM). That would have been a dream machine. I also like the idealogy of Walter when he states that a calculator should be a pocket calculator. That is my gripe with my main squeeze, an Hp 48G (although I have recently started to use an Hp 32sii). The Hp 50G can easily do anything and everything for anyone RIGHT NOW! All you have to do it carry it around. It takes up half the space of any breifcase or backpack (okay, I'm kidding, kind of). My Hp35s is nearly as big as an Hp48G, why is that?. That is another reason I applauded the Hp34s selection of using the Hp30B calculator platform. It was significantly smaller than the oversized Hp 35s. Even Ti has gotten brain rot on this matter. A plain simple Ti-30 is about the right size for a calculating tool, their new multi-view ti-30 and ti-36 professional are extra long and bulky. Their redeaming feature is a cover plate to protect the keyboard. I still prefer a case, but that is personal taste and not neccessarily a wise taste.
I have a Ti Nspire too. It is a great portable dedicated computer that had a dedicated math keyboard. Great for expoloring math concepts (after you learn how to use the beast ie sitting in class with a knowledgable instructor). However, it ain't that great for real world engineering. When I want to crunch numbers, I don't want to wait for my calculator to boot up. And then enter calc mode or have three layers of screens to move around in! I want to crunch numbers!!! But that may be the T-Rex in me and not the evolving engineer I should be... Edited: 13 Feb 2013, 6:03 p.m.
Re: HP41cv expiriences of a new user - Mike Morrow - 02-13-2013 Quote: Thanks, Ross! Actually, I've stated many times that the original HP-15C is overall the second best RPN calculator ever made, with the HP 42S in first place. I've got one of mine always near my PC.
Quote: I must plead not guilty, Ross. I was disappointed by the PSE bug and even more so by the power management issues, but I have always considered it a very serviceable calculator. I bought two! But I consider the original HP-15C to be a more satisfying machine to own. I have never called the HP 15C-LE "worthless", but I know several others have used that characterization. It's a very usable device that has a few unfortunate emulation errors that will never get fixed. That's the worst that I have to say about the HP 15C-LE.
Quote: That's also why the original HP-15C is just a serviceable as the HP-15C-LE (with 120 times the speed) for almost anything one is likely to need such a machine to do.
Quote: A truly great machine, now a quarter-century old and never matched in HP's line of RPN machines.
Quote: The HP 50G is the most capable handheld machine that has ever been made for serious work, IMHO. OK, forget about smartphones for a minute. :-)
Quote: I would love to see an HP 42S+ made officially by HP in the form of the HP 30b. There would be a need for sound and IR output as well from the hardware. The HP 30b is at least eight times faster than the HP 50G on those tasks for which it is capable.
Quote:
I'm with you there as well. Edited: 13 Feb 2013, 8:05 p.m.
Re: HP41cv experiences of a new user [ The Card Reader] - Wolfgang - 02-15-2013 I want to conclude my "mini series" with the last item I had in my HP41 package , the card reader.
Right now I write and debug my programs on the simulator, plot the barcode and scan it in the real HP41 with the wand. So that is the end of the report about my first steps into the HP41 world. Hope you had enjoyed my little postings.
The two projects still on my list: 2) Build an USB power adapter for the HP41, just because this is such a handy way to extend battery life on my office desk.
|